So disappointed with Prospero Burns

[Saint_Anger]

Hi all,

I just finished reading Prospero Burns, and gotta say I am so disappointed with it. At first, I thought this book would contain much information on how Space Wolves finally strikes Prospero, but the book just had it a little in 25% latter part of it. It spent too much on describing the life of a remembrance rather than even focusing on its title “Prospero Burns”. The intro on the back cover also mislead the most context of the book. If I knew it would be this boring, I would not buy it.:(
Does anyone, who already read and like it, share some opinion? I would like to know why it was sold over 1 million copies as it stated on the front cover.

Thanks

[Dalleron]

I think the title is a bit misleading. Yes, Prospero does indeed burn, but when I heard the title, I was thinking paralles story to 1k Sons.

It is about a remembrancer true, but that makes a story more relatable to us. Who hear can relate to a genetically engineered supersoldier? That's right. It gives us a more human view on things none of us could probably relate to. I think they were reaching for too much with the Kasper Hauser name and I had no clue what they were going on about/hinting at.

I don't think you can write a 600 page book of Space Wolves fighting everyone and expect it to be good.

I think it is a good book by itself. Misleading title for sure. It does give insight to the Space Wolves, and their fluff and way of life. I have a new appreciation for them cuz of this book. As much as that makes sense.

How did it sell 1 million copies? Dan Abnett wrote it. He is black library Gold, or was at least. If you read 1k Sons and liked it, you probably bought Prospero Burns. I did. Read the first one, bought the second. I was in no way disappointed. I found it rather enjoyable with all the little twists and turns through out the book.

[Saint_Anger]

I read A Thousand Sons and liked it, that’s why I want to know more about this event by buying Prospero Burns. But the result is as I mentioned above. I also liked Know No Fear by Dan Abnett, I enjoyed the pace of fighting in there that I could finished it in two days. Unlike Prospero Burns, it took about 3 months for me.

[Bigred]

I love it and personally think its the best novel in the entire series so far.

Here's my short version. Its one of Abnett's finest science fiction pieces that manages to transcend the genre. Its a great piece of sci-fi writing that just happens to be set in the Warhammer 40000 universe. Few if any of the other HH novels can make that claim.

In general as the Horus Heresy series goes on, I'm seeing a pattern. The combat is boring. Writing marine combat must get tiresome after some point for any author, but what draws you into a good old fashioned story is characters you can relate to. Astartes are very, very hard to relate to.

They are effectively immortal, super human, fearless, noble (sometimes craven), yadda, yadda - its like having to write an entire universe around legions of Clark Kent-Superman characters. At some point it gets dull and they all blur together.

But when you tell a story from the perspective of just a man, in the middle of great events that he knows are bigger than he is, well then - then you have the ingredients for fantastic storytelling.

I'm starting to really like the HH non astartes "storytellers" from Karkasy, Gramaticus, to Hauser, and now Oll Persson from Know no Fear. I want to know more about the Imperial Army, and Unification Terra, and the Origins of the Emperor, to the Thunder Warriors, what role will Babu Dhakal play, and all those other mysteries and moments that the larger than life Astartes can blot out with their mere presence.

In short, it is the fragile, flawed humans that take me to the Heresy, and while I like to look at all the Sturm and Drang of the Astartes tossing back the popcorn, in the end its the mere humans that remind you what they are really fighting for.

[Tzeentch's Dark Agent]

I'm not a fan of the Space Wolves, and a massive fan of the Thousand Sons, hence my ire towards this book. :p

[Saint_Anger]

In general as the Horus Heresy series goes on, I'm seeing a pattern. The combat is boring. Writing marine combat must get tiresome after some point for any author, but what draws you into a good old fashioned story is characters you can relate to. Astartes are very, very hard to relate to.

I understand this and it’s a good point. Writing something that reader can understand is probably making them enjoy. Astarte is sth only in a fiction, writing them could require lots of creativity and imagination. But if succeed, it would be great wonderful. I says I still have much room for the kind of Astarte’s storyteller and combats. From Argel’Tal, Ventanus and Ahriman, they are all great leading characters. It is Astartes that have a major role in shaping the Imperium, so detailing on them is undeniable anyway.

[Tzeentch's Dark Agent]

There's no "h" in Argel Tal. :p

WARNING: DO NOT TYPE VENTANUS INTO GOOGLE IMAGES

[Archon]

I liked the book a lot. At first i toughted, that it´s going to be a little boring, but the further i read, the better the book become. A very unique way to look at the SW with enough infos to see, whats happend on the other side of the debacel.

[energongoodie]

I...LOVE...this story. Have you read the other HH books?

Please give it another chance BOLS chum.

[Cpt Codpiece]

like the others i found 1kS and prospero burns have to be read pretty close together to make the true story of what happens and why and how.

while i felt 1kS was the stronger book (due to my chaos leanings) i really enjoyed them both.
again the kasper hauser ref i had to look up... but thankfully i did it when it was mentioned by the 1kS in the book :)

the whole end section of PB flipped what i thought was happening in the HH (dont want to give the plot away, but the stuff with hauser and the wolves and the revelation in the scene with russ.)

as for know no fear, another great book, but a little disracting with all of the time stamps and whatnot.

[Lemt]

***KINDA SPOILERS****
I really liked Prospero Burns. It shows you a bit of how the SW function, and it reveals the intrigues that took place during the HH. And Bear being in the book is awesome.

[Anggul]

I don't see the point in having it from a Remembrancer's point of view. It worked in Fulgrim because the Emperor's Children adored perfection and art, so there was an echo between them and the Remembrancers. In this case, it just feels like he ripped off the idea and assumed it would work with the Space Wolves and Thousand Sons for some reason. It just doesn't fit with them.

[Big Thunda]

I see the whole attack itself as the culmination of both stories- the joy is in the journey, not the destination. We all kind of know there's a massive battle at the end, described in A Thousand Sons, so this book delves into the "why and how?" from the opposing chapter's view. Honestly the book was not extremely action packed, but I felt it was a fantastic insight into Space Wolf live, and a great foil to "A Thousand Sons" which had more actual Prospero action IMHO. Anyways, I thought both were fantastic, and played nicely off each other.

[Cpt Codpiece]

I don't see the point in having it from a Remembrancer's point of view. It worked in Fulgrim because the Emperor's Children adored perfection and art, so there was an echo between them and the Remembrancers. In this case, it just feels like he ripped off the idea and assumed it would work with the Space Wolves and Thousand Sons for some reason. It just doesn't fit with them.

The thing that we have to remember with the earlier (chronological) HH books is that the remembrancer order was in all legions to some degree, so the galaxy would never forget what hardships were endured in the forging of the imperium, be it battle by the astartes/army or the compliance of 'new' worlds

it was the issue of the tithes and petitioners to horus that changed how the remembrancers were seen in the legions.
the only reason that the order was dissolved, was so terra could weed out traitors (as in deliverance lost), had the heresy not happened the way it did remembrancers would still form part in the legions.
even in real life wars and progress is not reported by the soldiers/frontieersman it is the reporters for our media that take down what has happened and 'remember' it, otherwise we would not learn from our past (like we do anyway LOL).
History is written by the victors but if there is no one there to report the victory how do we know we have won?

[Saint_Anger]

even in real life wars and progress is not reported by the soldiers/frontieersman it is the reporters for our media that take down what has happened and 'remember' it, otherwise we would not learn from our past (like we do anyway LOL).
History is written by the victors but if there is no one there to report the victory how do we know we have won?

It's ok to have a remembrancer to record everything what Astarte legion is doing, but "Prospero Burns" did mis led many readers that there gonna be many exciting things about their combats, ways of living. It contains too much about remembrancer. 75% of the book is nothing related to "Prospero Burns".

[Cpt Codpiece]

but the story of the remembrancer is not just a tale of the man, yes his story is covered from childhood to augmented man........ but there is another story being told in parrallel to the story of kasper hauser.

the main aims of the book (major spoiler alert) are to show the sleeper agents planted in the legions long before the events at davin, and how the whole build up to nikea was a ruse to stop the main weapon that the legions could use against creatures of the warp..... psychers

all of this was laid out long before davin, and maybe even long before the events in the first heretic.
the question now remains...... who planned and acted out these events???

the actual sacking of prospero is an aside to the story laid out above, but the journey kasper has with the wolves, from *laning* on fenris to his release by russ is an indicator to how the wolves operate. showing they are more complex than most people give them credit for.

[CouchViking]

I loved this book. A great piece of science fiction, vivid characters, thought provoking themes and a stark contrast of fantasy and science fiction. I will agree that the title is misleading and is not as action laden with marine vs marine as some would hope, however this is not a bad thing.
Instead, we have one mans journey and assimilation into a tribal existence from a very civilized one. We are painted an incredibly vivid picture of the people of Fenris while leaving a air of mystery about them. I thought the main character had great depth and heart, and was probably one of the relatable character in the HH to date.
Although, I will jump on the band wagon here and say I wish he didn't have quite so many flashbacks. I wish Dan had focused a little more on Kasper's time with the Rout and especially Russ, than focusing on his past so much.

[Anggul]

The thing that we have to remember with the earlier (chronological) HH books is that the remembrancer order was in all legions to some degree, so the galaxy would never forget what hardships were endured in the forging of the imperium, be it battle by the astartes/army or the compliance of 'new' worlds

it was the issue of the tithes and petitioners to horus that changed how the remembrancers were seen in the legions.
the only reason that the order was dissolved, was so terra could weed out traitors (as in deliverance lost), had the heresy not happened the way it did remembrancers would still form part in the legions.
even in real life wars and progress is not reported by the soldiers/frontieersman it is the reporters for our media that take down what has happened and 'remember' it, otherwise we would not learn from our past (like we do anyway LOL).
History is written by the victors but if there is no one there to report the victory how do we know we have won?

Oh yeah I know they all had remembrancers, but the only reason it was from their point of view in Fulgrim is because of their obvious connection, the book being about the corruption by Slaanesh and their desire for perfection, obviously synonymous with an artist (with Fulgrim literally making art). The Space Wolves and Thousand Sons have no kind of reflection to remembrancers in any way, and using their point of view adds nothing to the story. Needed more Spehss Mahreen.

[AnEnemy]

I didn't like Prospero Burns either. I thought it was a passionless hack job. The parts of the novel that actually related to the Space Wolves were good. Wouldn't change anything about that.

The parts that the novel fell through for me were...well...more than 75% of the novel really. Abnett doesn't like writing SMs. He's said so numerous times. He can't do it well so he doesn't want to do it. I guess he got past that hang up for Know No Fear. Good for UMs fans and bad for SWs fans.

So he injected this human character that, really, is the entire book. It shouldn't have been called, Prospero Burns. It should have been called, There's Something About Hauser. Because just about every one in the 40K universe had a finger in this dude. Abnett used this character to sidestep any real world building on Fenris or with the SWs. Smoke and mirrors. And it worked on most people from what I've seen in similar discussions on other forums.

For those that don't know how to use Wikipedia; Kasper Hauser was a historical figure(early 1800s) and inspired a film post mortem. He showed up a police station with a letter listing his name and purporting that he had spent the entirety of his life in a cell after his mother abandoned him to a stranger. The stranger fed and groomed him, but never allowed Hauser to know his name or see his face. Hauser spent the rest of his life going from one nobleman's house to another as a curiosity. It's worth mentioning that an autopsy led to a theory that he had epilepsy...a condition Abnett was diagnosed with during the lengthy writing process of Prospero Burns. So...a historian and writer grows old and infirm...gets a new position with the SWs...is granted a new, better, body and learns how to kick *** from super vikings? Maybe I'm the only one that saw this as some of the most base author wank I've come across.

The whole thing struck me as lazy to be honest. That, combined, with the horribly written battle scenes in the last act made this book a disappointment for me. I'm used to Deus Ex Machina in 40K, but damned if Abnett didn't run that **** into the wall, back up, and do it again.

[Cpt Codpiece]

i will admit the fighting was...... weak, and the lack of marines in combat was a little bit disapointing. the name was very misleading, given half the book is flashbacks and only the last bit is prospero.

but i did really enjoy the 'story', the whole scene setting was great, abnet is well known for his complex plots and this was one of them (to me anyway), be it that he may well have drew direct inspiration from real life, who would'nt.

[Saint_Anger]

Finally, I can sell it to one of my friend who play Space Wolves. The book is such a waste in my collection.
P/S My friend finished reading it in two days by skipping all the first part and starting where Russ appeared.