GW & Child protection

[Grailkeeper]

Today my work life (Which is keeping me too busy) and my warhammer life collided. A man was convicted in the Circuit Court in Dublin of attempting to have consensual sex with a 14 year old girl, for which he received a 3 year sentence with all but 16 months suspended. It was mentioned that he used to work in a Toy shop painting models- by which I presume he worked in a Games Workshop.

When I was discussing the case over lunch with a collegue I learned that GW (in Ireland at least) now makes people undergo the same police backround checks that Teachers etc have to undego before employing them. This is because so many children hang out at GWs. At first it made me feel uneasy but thinking on it I think GW is to be commended for taking this step.

What are your thoughts and do you know if this happens in other countries?

[gwensdad]

I know people who work at a major TOY StoRe here in the US and they work all the time with children but never have mentioned passing a criminal background check. (and some would fail)

Sounds like a GW initiative to make parents feel safe about dropping off their kids. I'd say it would be great if all stores that had younger customers did this but I'd get attacked by local store owners for "big government socialism" (even if we had a store years ago where one of the owners WAS a convicted sex offender)

[scadugenga]

I have to give kudos for GW to put that into place.

My old job duties had me liaising with the local police and having to obtain copies of the local registered sex offender lists every semester. (I worked for a university)

The reason for this is that we wanted to make sure we didn't have any sexual predators living on campus.

What was sickening about the entire thing was that the university wasn't concerned with child sexual predators as such, because our student population didn't fit their victim profile.

I believe the discussion ran something like this:

Me: Wait--so your not concerned with child molesters living on campus as you are conventional predators?

Administrator-who-shall-not-be-named: Well, yes, actually. A child molester isn't likely to attack one of our students. The university wouldn't have to worry about the liability risk.


That was the last year I worked there. For this, and other sundry wtf moments.

But in short--I'm all for background checks for anyone working in an environment where children may be at risk.

[eldargal]

I think it is sad it had to come to that at a societal level, but very commendable of GW to do so.

[Wolfshade]

There is a requirement to have CRB checks for all staff owing to their "teaching" with the children and that this contact can be un-supervised and regular.

http://www.legislation.gov.uk/ukpga/2006/47/schedule/4

[SotonShades]

Not sure if this is purely a Leicester thing, but my local GW is taking part in a scheme where most of the local stores have a handheld radio, all on the smae channel and in communication with the police. In short it allows all the local retailers to report immediately on anti-social behaviour and make each other and the police immediately aware of shop lifters, giving accurate descriptions etc. It has also allowed some shops to be able to close their doors to stop running thieves having a bolt hole to escape from being chased by the police.

While I'm sure a system like this wouldn't work or possibly be appropriate in large cities, it's been reported that it has had a significanty effect on reducing crime and ASB in Leicester, to some of the lowest levels in the country. This from a city that used to have a full Riot Squad posted in the city centre everynight of the week because ASB was so bad.

Again, something GW deserves kudos for being involved in.

[Aldramelech]

Games Workshop shouldn't get any kudos for this, its a legal requirement.

[DrLove42]

Not for a retail establishment, which GW stores are.

Ive worked in kid intense shops (thats sounds quite bad...) (game stores) before and you dont need to for them

[Wolfshade]

I did not think that retail shops were on the exceptions list.
Also, teaching someone to play the game is tutoring and as such should be a regulated activity.

[lattd]

Because CRB's are now mandatory for anyone who is likely to work with children more than 1 hour a week? I went for an interview with GW and they asked me about my CRB and told me i would have to do one again. Even the scout association has CRB's as mandatory and we check them every 2 years rather than every 3.

[Wolfshade]

Exactly, though you have to be careful as a lot of people try and claim that there is a requirement to have a CRB check when there isn't.

If I were to play a sub-18 year old I wouldn't need one
If I were regularly teaching a sub-18 year old under the supervision of a CRB checked person I wouldn't need one
If I were to teach a sub-18 year old as a one off I wouldn't need one, either at my normal club or at a different one I wouldn't need one
If I were to transport a sub-18 year old as a one-off domestic arrangement I wouldn't need one


I've been invlovled in hobbies whereby the overarcing group wanted everyone to have a CRB check when a sub 18 year old joined

[DrLove42]

There is a bit of a difference in Scout Leader and Store Worker. Scout leader you are a registered supervisor, cos i bet the parents don't stick around. That might happen in a GW store, but the law gets fuzzy, cos at the end of the day it is a store, not a babysitting service, despite the way parents might see it

As i said, i've worked in several store with a lot of direct contact with kids (again that just sounds dodgy) and thse stores dont need CRB checks.

[lattd]

I know they recently changed the law on this, as well.

[Firebird]

I did not think that retail shops were on the exceptions list.
Also, teaching someone to play the game is tutoring and as such should be a regulated activity.

Thats crazy and an insane comment...

[Aldramelech]

No my friend that is UK law.

This is unfortunately is not as stupid as it sounds, I work in education and the sad fact of the matter is that the type of people who want to meet children for nefarious reasons are now looking for any way possible to do so since the tightening of the law, they have found it almost impossible to use the "traditional" avenues of approach and have been forced to become very creative. Games Workshop is not a traditional retail outlet and could almost be classed as a youth club whether they like it or not.

[scadugenga]

No my friend that is UK law.

This is unfortunately is not as stupid as it sounds, I work in education and the sad fact of the matter is that the type of people who want to meet children for nefarious reasons are now looking for any way possible to do so since the tightening of the law, they have found it almost impossible to use the "traditional" avenues of approach and have been forced to become very creative. Games Workshop is not a traditional retail outlet and could almost be classed as a youth club whether they like it or not.

That's pretty effed up, Aldy...

Next thing you'll know they'll have undercover cops hanging out at GW stores.

I thought you were supposed to be the more civilized country? :)

[Wolfshade]

The idea behind it was a good one, as the law also extends to "vulnerable adults" it was meant to be safeguarding those at most "risk". Unfortunatley, the way in which it was implemented meant that instead of being subtle and a targetted approach it was applied quite liberally.
What makes matters worse is when it is mis-interpreted by an over zealous body. There have been a couple of cases where bands of volunteers have either disbanded or banned under 18s from partaking in an activity because of a mis-interpritation.
My two areas of concern for the legislation in general are that CRB checks are non-transferable so for every different organisation that I work/volunteer (in a leadership role) at that would puts me in contact with children I would need a seperate check for each body, at one point my sister had 6 different ones. The other is that these checks don't technically expire, though a lot of organisations have their own ruling that they require each CRB check to be redone every 2 or 3 years [/rant]

[lattd]

I thought that they had changed the law so you can transfer a CRB if it was in a certain period of time. Although the UK changes laws so quickly in the last 20 years that sometimes its hard to keep up.

[Aldramelech]

That's pretty effed up, Aldy...

Next thing you'll know they'll have undercover cops hanging out at GW stores.

I thought you were supposed to be the more civilized country? :)


If only that were true:rolleyes:

This what kicked it all off really:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Soham_murders

It came to light that Huntley had already been of interest to the Police and should never have been employed anywhere near children.

I live in a sleepy little city in Devon and even here shocking things happen:

http://www.caroleverett.com/ce-crime/kate-b.htm

No one has ever been caught for this appalling crime. Two years ago a Teacher was sacked from one of the city's secondary schools for having a sexual relationship with a pupil, this stuff happens everywhere.

As I said I work in an educational establishment and am heavily involved with safeguarding, I've seen lots of stuff about the lengths these people will go to to get close to children. If you think that it would be far fetched for such a person to "get into" the hobby in order to obtain employment at GW so they could get close to kids, think again, I've seen cases where they've gone far further.

These people are very clever, very devious and very very sick.