Starting Space Marines, looking for input

[Hive777]

I got a copy of the current SM codex as part of an Ebay lot when I was starting my 'nid army, and I've had it on the shelf for the last couple of months. I decided to pull it down and start reading up on the SM--as research on the enemy--and started thinking that SM would be a good 2nd army for me. It would be very different from playing nids and is well-supported by GW (and I can get a lot of stuff used).

So, I'm wondering: play standard Space Marines (starting my own chapter, essentially) or should I consider one of the more specialized variants (Black Angels, Dark Templar, etc.)?

I'm tempted to go with standard SM, because I already have the codex, but I wanted to get some other opinions. I'm not so much concerned with playing something that's hot in the meta, or 'guaranteed' to win based on its codex; I'd like something that's balanced between shooting and CC, and fun to play.

Any opinions or input is welcome!

[Thornblood]

My advice- stick with the standard 'vanilla' flavoured Space Marines. Pick a colour you want to paint, maybe that gives you a break from the colours of your nids and grab the models you like the most. Then build around that.

For a Breakdown of codex pikings though-
Codex Space Marine (standard/vanilla/ultramarines- most chapters). Good rule book, slightly more shooty than close combat.
Codex Space Wolves- Like vanilla marines, bit more elite, shootings good, close combat becomes very good.
Codex Blood Angels- Like vanilla marines but with some fast attack and close combat bonus. Plus good psykers.
Codex Black Templars- Assault horde marine army.
Codex Grey Knights- The elite army of 40k- shoot very very well. Close combat well. Everyone is a psyker.
Codex Dark Angels- Like vanilla marines, but with a hint of a different flavour. Possibilities for all-bike and all-terminator army... Also this one is likely to have a new codex released soon.

The annoying codex flipping- You could pick a Dark Angels successor chapter and use either dark angels or vanilla marine codex for it.

[Sure]

Go with the fluff or chapter you like the best. all of the Space Marine codices offer effective builds for competitive play (the Dark Angels Deatwing may not be winning big tournaments, but you'll give most lists a run for their money).

[MaltonNecromancer]

They build solid competitive lists, but I have to say that I prefer using them for theme builds - I like to run a Sternguard/vanguard-based Deathwatch list.

It's a very versatile codex; it's a real shame that most internet lists don't seem to want to go beyond the narrow confines of the "must be a tournament winner" list.

Just do something awesome. Decide which models you like best and then tailor a list around those. That's what I like to do.

[Transmutedelf]

All around I have to say vanilla spacemarines are the best for well rounded. While I dont collect them anything you see come out forgeworld or from Games workshop in Power armor you can use in your army. Their is so many different options and different ways to play with them. Space wolves have a similar degree of freedom of builds.

Dark Angles And Grey Knights sometimes feels like your building/buying two different armies. With Dark Angles you could go all bike or all term or some hybrid. Grey Knights Seem to fall into three major builds. All Terminators going for the elite of the elite, or even a Purifier list. THan there is a Cortez Inquisitional list that for me Im slowly building up that might be fun.

Black Templar I dont know enough about to pass any judgement on them. Blood Angles I believe have options more so than Ive seen but Ive seen either mech lists or assault lists.

[Hive777]

Sounds like basic codex Marines are the way to go. I don't want anything too specialized, and I like the idea of developing my own chapter identity and fluff.

The "must be a tournament winner" is something that all games with a tournament structure have to deal with. I don't think there's any way to avoid it. Personally, I don't keep track of that sort of thing; I usually build an army around a particular concept I want to explore, or particular pieces that I want to try out.

[Mephiston69]

Space Marines are easily the way to go for a beginner
But word of wisdom...dont get a Techmarine or Whirlwind :P

[Mr. Furious]

Space Marines are definitely a fun army to play. Tough to go wrong with any of them but since you already have the main SM codex I'd suggest starting out with an army from that book.

With that in mind, read the fluff for the different chapters in that book and pay close attention to the HQ and independent characters that are specific to each chapter. Find the chapter you like with the HQs and ICs that make the army play in a way that appeals to you and then build from there. Even "Vanilla" marines have their unique traits and skills that make them unique.

[Hive777]

Thanks for your comments, Mr. Furious--they actually tie into a question I thought of this morning. I'm wondering about the unique/independent characters. They're obviously, in terms of the fluff in the codex, tied to particular chapters. In real/game terms, is it allowed to use one of them and rename him as being part of my chapter? (That is, as long as I clarify to the other player which model it is, and which codex unit's stats and abilities it is using)

[Mr. Furious]

I believe you can use hq's from different chapters as long as they are from the same book. For example: Calgar and Cantor is OK but Calgar and Grimnar is not. You can't mix and match codices but you can mix and match chapters/companies within the same codex. I've never had to make that decision because i generally keep my armies homogenous but I believe that's the way it works.

[Mephiston69]

I believe you can use hq's from different chapters as long as they are from the same book. For example: Calgar and Cantor is OK but Calgar and Grimnar is not. You can't mix and match codices but you can mix and match chapters/companies within the same codex. I've never had to make that decision because i generally keep my armies homogenous but I believe that's the way it works.
Agree, as long as it's the same codex
You could even take Calgar and Forgefathe Vulkan together and call you army "Ultrasalamanders" lol
Not considered "fluffy" but I wouldnt imagine anyone actually having a problem playing against you

[Kawauso]

Yeah, that's a lot of points on two models - I wouldn't mind if an opponent did that, heh.

Could also lead to some wacky battle stories.

But really, speaking from personal experience, the vanilla SM book is a great codex.
I've had a Salamanders-esque army for a couple of years now and it's loads of fun and really effective (got a counts-as Vulkan for my chapter master, but oftentimes I run a plain ol' captain for an HQ). A lot of flexibility in that book, with a slant towards close-range firepower.

I guess the only 'downside' to the vanilla book is there's nothing that jumps out as super flashy, really.

[Hive777]

I had the thought of doing a SM chapter along the lines of a 'Band of Brothers'-type advance force of futuristic paratroopers. Commandos with minimal vehicles, or even just lots of drop pods, dropping into whatever fight is at hand with what they can carry. Could probably do that reasonably well with codex SMs.

It's just a bit hard for me to imagine SMs relying heavily on tanks or artillery--maybe I'm romanticizing them a bit, but I do really like the image of the squads and leaders on the battlefield going man-to-man (or man-to-thing) with the enemy, or using specialized units to take out tanks and large creatures. Maybe I've just too much of the fiction...

[SeraphimAngels]

I had the thought of doing a SM chapter along the lines of a 'Band of Brothers'-type advance force of futuristic paratroopers. Commandos with minimal vehicles, or even just lots of drop pods, dropping into whatever fight is at hand with what they can carry. Could probably do that reasonably well with codex SMs.

It's just a bit hard for me to imagine SMs relying heavily on tanks or artillery--maybe I'm romanticizing them a bit, but I do really like the image of the squads and leaders on the battlefield going man-to-man (or man-to-thing) with the enemy, or using specialized units to take out tanks and large creatures. Maybe I've just too much of the fiction...

Most of the books or anything like that is going to show where the Space marines wiped out this portion of a planet or what have you, the best thing to do is to see which Space marine chapter speaks to you personally. Or if you just want to make up your own chapter and go from there.
When you find the chapter you like then its easy as cake for you to get the models and go from there. You can paint them either "codex" style which means exactly like they are showed in your codex or you can paint them as a successor chapter from a different 'founding' its all up to you.
Find out how you like to play, what your style would be and then pick the chapter that speaks to you. For me it was the Dark Angels, I loved the medeival feel of them, also their models are amazing, so it sold me to the Chapter scheme and I painted them codex style... I've been playin with them for a couple years now and usually win more than i lose, its all about staying true to your style. :cool: