Character bases!

[wolflold]

Hi, i model all my characters on 40mm bases instead of 20mm bases, not because its 'better' (because its not) but just to let them stand out more! Normaly a space marine captain with artificer armour has a 20mm base but if you give him terminator armour he has a 40mm base, in both options he has a 2+/4++ save. I had a 'debat' the other day with my opponent and he said i was 'cheating'! I explained this wasn't the case, and replaced the character with a 20mm base model. Still i think its silly...

Usualy its not a problem, but if i would go to a GT for example can this become a problem?

[MaltonNecromancer]

I wouldn't have a problem with it, but it is "technically" cheating. Your friend's opinion is valid.

Think about it: essentially, a larger base means a model can potentially engage more enemy models in assault, as well as block movement of enemy models more effectively. As a result, it "makes sense" to put an asault specialist character on a 40mm base rather than a 25mm one as it's a simple way to increase their combat effectiveness in a real way. In the right circumstances, this can be a massive advantage with weapons that rely on base-to-base contact (Shardnets, Lash Whips, etc...)

Frankly, to my mind, it's a very minor quibble, but some people get very het up over these sorts of things (which they have every right to). As always, check with your opponent beforehand, and if they refuse to play against it, just be gracious about it (as you have been). If you're friendly and polite, I doubt that many people will care.

[Thornblood]

Magnets. Magnet under foot, magnet under base. Pick and choose what base when. I tried with a pin, and then ended up adding blu-tac to keep it in place before but it didnt work out so well :(

[Wolfshade]

It is only cheating if it breaks the rules. The only rule regarding bases is that if a model is supplied with a base it should be attached to that base. This often leads to problems when people play with older models eg the old terminators had the small bases compared with the new terminators that have large bases.
When it comes to base size in GTs it all comes down to the specific rules of the GT itself. Often they specify what size bases models should be on.

[Wildcard]

There is a huge difference what size the base is, in both downgrading and upgrading the size.

A good example is Grey Knights brotherhood champion. It has no attack value in its profile, instead it can strike as many times as he has enemy models in base to base contact:

20mm base: you can get 5 (6 if you push it) 20mm in B2B
40mm base: you can easily get 8 20mm bases in b2b

20mm base: you can get 4 40mm bases in b2b
40mm base: you can get 6 40mm bases in b2b

And sometimes its not just about how many enemy models you can engage, its also how many of them can engage you.

It also has a drawbacks if you field a bigger base (either just that you want to, or that it is intended that way):
A dreadknight with his large oval base will block all the change to reinforcements in tight spots. If the enemy manages to lock your dreadknight into a narrow corridor, there is no way any of your army behind him will be able to help the dreadknight in close combat
-------------------------------------

And then Imperial Guard example:
- IG gets to field 15 heavy weapons / troop slot. All these should be on the large 60mm bases. This means it will take alot of space on the table.
Now, the most generally used weapon is, lets say, a missile launcher. That weapon can easily be given on a single model to use, and it fits really nicely on a 20mm base.

15x 40mm = 600mm "more space" on the table for your units. And its just the first troop slot. Feel free to multiply that by the full 6 troop slots and it starts really to show the difference

This will not only affect the way they are being targeted (large bases will more easily be under the 3" or 5" blasts), but how much firepower IG player can put in one spot. Easily demonstrated by an example again:

Put 15 dreadnoughts side by side, and then put 15 normal models on 20mm bases side by side and you understand what i mean..

[SotonShades]

Please read the second and third paragraphs on pg 3 of the rulebook.

In short it says that models supplied with a base must have one and that it is OK to have a model on a larger display base, but you should check with your opponant before using said model.

Most people won't have a problem with it, but some will and having an alternative model on the correctly sized base would be helpful or possibly a ring on the larger base showing where the normal 25mm base would come to. As thronblood suggested, magnetising the base is also an option.

[dreadnaughtguy]

For me I usually look at weather you are trying to get an advantage from the way you are modeling, or if it is for asthetic reasons. If you have a shooty character standing on a rock on his base and use it to try to shoot over a transport, cheating. If you put a heavy assault based character on a larger base to gain extra attacks, (per the GK example given) thats cheating. If you have a sniper on a 40mm base standing so he is shooting over a bush or other such terain incorperated onto his base, thats cool modeling.

Keep in mind if you go to a GT be ready to use what they require, they may say check with your opponent, or they may say you have to use the correct base.

I did like the base doesn't matter from 4th where it was more of a "rule of cool", but with TLOS you remove that type of creativity.

[PhatCat]

Unfortunately, it is "cheating," intentional or not. 40mm bases give you an advantage in disembarking, for example, as well as potentially in assault, shooting, and any "bubble" effects that extend from the base. I'd recommend that you rebase if you want them to stand out, get some cool resin bases with special designs that are of the proper size. Sorry.

[BS FADE]

As people are saying using different size bases weather it be malicious or not, does kind of cheat certain mechanics of the game.

*Special base contact rules
*Bubble effects
*Blast shooting
*disembarking
*probably some more……

When these situations come up as long as you’re not being able to take advantage of it because of your improper bases I personally believe most people should be fine with it. But you should have a back up plan when someone brings it up even if your not in the wrong.

[dreadnaughtguy]

That is one of the issues that has cropped up with 5th edition. In 4th you were allowed to use any size base you wanted because the game was abstract. Now we have TLOS and you must use the "correct" size base. That is "correct" acording to the current model and the base supplied not older models and such.

I am not sold on the TLOS game mechanic for this reason.

[inquisitorsog]

I'm forgetting who it is, but someone manufactures bases specifically to be inserted into a large base for display purposes. The "standard" base has vertical edges so that it blends in when put into the larger receiving base. That way if your opponent is cool with it or the rules change to make it irrelevant, you can switch back to the larger base.

[Wolfshade]

Unfortunately, it is "cheating," intentional or not... Cheating involves breaking a rule. There is no rule broken putting models on a larger base, however, you need your opponents consent. In tourneys this might not be the case because the tournament introduces additional rules which aren't core.


Now we have TLOS and you must use the "correct" size base. That is "correct" acording to the current model and the base supplied not older models and such.
I can't seem to find that ruling my rule book anywhere, could you provide the page reference?

[SotonShades]

I can't seem to find that ruling my rule book anywhere, could you provide the page reference?

Pg 3 of the rulebook provides all of the rules (and by that I really mean only one rule) regarding base size.

[Wolfshade]

Yes I know, my point was that forcing people to re-base to modern sizes isn't part of the core rules and people justifying it by saying that is is part of the rules are mistaken. That is unless I've missed something in the rule book, hence asking for the page reference so that either I can look it up if I am mistaken, or if not hopefully, change peoples views over legacy bases