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archimbald
09-18-2009, 12:19 PM
Worth it??????

Chumbalaya
09-18-2009, 03:40 PM
Yes

arkfatalis
09-18-2009, 06:19 PM
If your thinking purely in points costs then yes. However, if you have a huge mech force then the heavy support slot can be a bit draining.A heavy weapon squad with autocannons costs 75 points, but for that they get 3 lasgun shots extra which are lame, but count as a troop choice for getting objectives and laying down fire while your other troops advance.A Hydra, has 2 twin linked autocannons and costs the same as a heavy weapon squad would, as you would replace an autocannon for a heavy bolter . The hydra can't get objectives but with the armour it is more durable and you have a higher chance to take down skimmers, valks, tau stuff, etc and and can stop outflanking bikes which can be a pain in the ***.Also, for 10 extra points you can give a a sb or hs , which can lay down extra fire power.So, if you have a spare slot then yes. Also, HWS can be one shot killed now but using multiple hydras in a squad can be a pain as one can get imobolised quite easily and if you move it counts as being destroyed.

crazyredpraetorian
09-18-2009, 09:37 PM
Hydras are great for the price. They have a 72" range and ignore "flat out" saves for bikes and skimmers.

SandWyrm
09-18-2009, 09:41 PM
Worth it??????

Absolutely. Same cost as a HWS, but without the S6 insta-death and the LD7 Running Away. Plus great range and the anti-skimmer bonus. Only downside is that they can't hold objectives and you're pretty much limited to one squadron of 3 unless you're willing to give up some Russes.

I took 2 to the 'Ard Boyz semi-finals and they did a great job killing 3 Daemon Princes and a Great Unclean One in my first two games.

George Labour
09-18-2009, 09:44 PM
In my current escalation league I've used the Aegis quad gun on chimera version of the hydra and they have become some of the most feared vehicles I can currently field, second only to my valks/vends. The 72 inch range, rerolls for misses, and armor mean they're seen as scarey by even my Necron and MEQ opponents. They're great for shopping up things like armor 12 or less transports, eldar elite, and orks. Combined with my mechanized rush of chimeras and infantry I often simply overhwhelm my opponent with scarey things causing him to make mistakes.

My fave moment with them was the time one hydra wiped out three broadsides in one shooting phase. ^^

Aldramelech
09-18-2009, 11:55 PM
I agree with all the above. Its a great asset to the guard. My only problem is the lack of an affordable model for it, the forgeworld conversion being way too expensive.

AirHorse
09-19-2009, 06:27 AM
Grab yourself an aegis defense line and get shoving one of the quad autocannons from that on a chimera and you are sorted :D

SandWyrm
09-19-2009, 11:42 AM
Grab yourself an aegis defense line and get shoving one of the quad autocannons from that on a chimera and you are sorted :D

That will definitely work, but it's ugly as sin. I've converted mine using IG infantry autocannons. I extended the barrels with plastic tubes of the same diameter and mounted all four of them together in a center-quad arrangement similar to a Russian ZSU AAA tank.

Aldramelech
09-19-2009, 01:11 PM
That will definitely work, but it's ugly as sin. I've converted mine using IG infantry autocannons. I extended the barrels with plastic tubes of the same diameter and mounted all four of them together in a center-quad arrangement similar to a Russian ZSU AAA tank.

Agreed. Dont like the Aegis quad and think it looks wrong mounted. Trying to obtain a cheap Gepard or 2S6 kit to convert.

TSINI
09-19-2009, 01:23 PM
That will definitely work, but it's ugly as sin. I've converted mine using IG infantry autocannons. I extended the barrels with plastic tubes of the same diameter and mounted all four of them together in a center-quad arrangement similar to a Russian ZSU AAA tank.

well done for extending the barrels, it annoys me when people don't bother :D

oh and while we're on the subject, yes definately. my vulture died the same turn it arrived due to an orkified hydra :(

RocketRollRebel
09-20-2009, 01:11 AM
If i had the money to get a pair in the next two weeks b4 the tourny I'm going to I wouldnt but a pair of them is about $100 bucks ($140 if u go forge world). They are great tho. One of the few vehicles that I'd put into a squadron.

The West Coast Knight
09-20-2009, 09:20 AM
If your thinking purely in points costs then yes. However, if you have a huge mech force then the heavy support slot can be a bit draining.A heavy weapon squad with autocannons costs 75 points, but for that they get 3 lasgun shots extra which are lame, but count as a troop choice for getting objectives and laying down fire while your other troops advance.A Hydra, has 2 twin linked autocannons and costs the same as a heavy weapon squad would, as you would replace an autocannon for a heavy bolter . The hydra can't get objectives but with the armour it is more durable and you have a higher chance to take down skimmers, valks, tau stuff, etc and and can stop outflanking bikes which can be a pain in the ***.Also, for 10 extra points you can give a a sb or hs , which can lay down extra fire power.So, if you have a spare slot then yes. Also, HWS can be one shot killed now but using multiple hydras in a squad can be a pain as one can get imobolised quite easily and if you move it counts as being destroyed.

Just to clear this up Heavy weapons teams do not get to fire there Lasguns as well as the heavy it is one or the other and only one shot for the base with Las Gun.
Unfortuinatley in the Codex on pg 29 it says the 2 man team counts as 2 for transport but counts as 1 model for shooting.

Oh and Hydras are great!
Love shooting down Skimmers

Aldramelech
09-20-2009, 09:43 AM
Just to clear this up Heavy weapons teams do not get to fire there Lasguns as well as the heavy it is one or the other and only one shot for the base with Las Gun.
Unfortuinatley in the Codex on pg 29 it says the 2 man team counts as 2 for transport but counts as 1 model for shooting.

Oh and Hydras are great!
Love shooting down Skimmers

Thats not what is says at all........... It says it is treated as a single model, it dosnt mention shooting at all!
As the 'Model' gets 2 attacks (Both crewmen fighting) I say that the 'Model' gets two lasgun shots providing it isnt shooting the Hvy Weap.

Xas
09-20-2009, 12:56 PM
and single modells can shoot one weapon each turn.

only tyranid weaponry bases its number of shots on the number of attacks in the profile.



on the other hand a space marine captain firing 3 shots with his plasma pistol because he has 3 base attacks would be fun!

my german codex doesnt even say that weapon teams have lasguns at all :(

Aldramelech
09-20-2009, 02:06 PM
But you've completely ignored the fact that you've taken the quote from the book and added your own little interpretation on the end and then tried to pass it on as fact! Your wrong........

There are two blokes on the stand, both have a lasgun and it defiantly does say they have a lasguns in the English (and therefore definitive) version.

If a single model can shoot one weapon each turn that does not mean one shot! It means it can shoot the Hvy weap or the Lasguns. Or are you saying the Auto cannon gets one shot????

Its just this kind of twisted interpretation that gets right up my nose. Wheres the common sense for gods sake!

TSINI
09-20-2009, 03:32 PM
while i agree that there is no rule allowing you to fire the lasgun from a heavy weapon team, I was readng through the rulebook and found that attack bikes can fire 2 weapons, and they are classed as infantry, so its not perverting the rules to allow a single non-vehicle model to fire 2 weapons.

I think that in friendly games, you should allow the loader to fire, the gun's set up and ready to go, why shouldnt he let loose with the others?

until its clarified, I guess its just not going to be tourney legal.

The West Coast Knight
09-20-2009, 10:25 PM
I am afraid the Heavy weapons team is treated in all capacities as a single model except in transports.
If a weapons squad was a Monsterous Creature it could fire more than one weapon per turn but its not.

I wish they could fire their Las guns don't get me wrong, and if the person you are playing against is OK with it than thats cool but its not how it is intended to work.

RocketRollRebel
09-21-2009, 12:02 AM
I am afraid the Heavy weapons team is treated in all capacities as a single model except in transports.
If a weapons squad was a Monsterous Creature it could fire more than one weapon per turn but its not.

I wish they could fire their Las guns don't get me wrong, and if the person you are playing against is OK with it than thats cool but its not how it is intended to work.

It may be just a case of confusion since the "loader" could fire is las gun in the last codex. The two man heavy weapons team was essentially a modeling thing since the second member was really just another guardsmen with a las gun. Now they are a 2 wound model so you may only fire one weapon per turn.

Denzark
09-21-2009, 01:18 AM
Agreed. Dont like the Aegis quad and think it looks wrong mounted. Trying to obtain a cheap Gepard or 2S6 kit to convert.

Like the idea of gepard but would prefer a ZSU to a 2s6. But i'll tell you what I have got saved in the bitz box. GI Joe (Action Force in UK) had a chinook-esque helicopter called a tomahawk - with an awesome chin gun with a gatling cannon on. The turret ring would sit nicely on the back hatch. think the M111 with the vulcan on...

bb-dawg
09-21-2009, 11:53 AM
If i had the money to get a pair in the next two weeks b4 the tourny I'm going to I wouldnt but a pair of them is about $100 bucks ($140 if u go forge world). They are great tho. One of the few vehicles that I'd put into a squadron.

Hiya! Not to "jack" anyones post but here's a converted Hydra I made with a Gundam Serpent Custom 1/100 scale. The thing may be a bit big but it works. Linky here: http://www.bigshoota.com/xtras/Hydra.jpg.

Just throwing it out there in case someone's looking for inspiration while we wait for the model.

SandWyrm
09-21-2009, 02:14 PM
Like the idea of gepard but would prefer a ZSU to a 2s6. But i'll tell you what I have got saved in the bitz box. GI Joe (Action Force in UK) had a chinook-esque helicopter called a tomahawk - with an awesome chin gun with a gatling cannon on. The turret ring would sit nicely on the back hatch. think the M111 with the vulcan on...

That piece would make a great turret! Just make sure you add in some smaller details so the scale looks appropriate. Here's a quick WIP pic of my Hydras using the extended infantry ACs. The turrets aren't final, but I really like the ZSU look to the guns.

http://www.goreham.com/misc/hydras_wip.jpg

SandWyrm
09-21-2009, 02:20 PM
Hiya! Not to "jack" anyones post but here's a converted Hydra I made with a Gundam Serpent Custom 1/100 scale. The thing may be a bit big but it works. Linky here: http://www.bigshoota.com/xtras/Hydra.jpg.

Just throwing it out there in case someone's looking for inspiration while we wait for the model.

Hehe, that's pretty big all right. :)

I don't know that I'd do four gatling-type guns tho. I'd be ok doing just one and saying it counts as 4 seperate guns, or maybe two so your opponent doesn't get confused when he gets a weapon destroyed result but the Hydra is still firing at half it's normal rate.

Denzark
09-21-2009, 02:44 PM
That piece would make a great turret! Just make sure you add in some smaller details so the scale looks appropriate. Here's a quick WIP pic of my Hydras using the extended infantry ACs. The turrets aren't final, but I really like the ZSU look to the guns.

http://www.goreham.com/misc/hydras_wip.jpg

Yeah happy with that I like your zeus-esque hydras very much.

Aldramelech
09-22-2009, 12:25 AM
Yeah, like those alot!

Aldramelech
09-22-2009, 12:48 AM
Like the idea of gepard but would prefer a ZSU to a 2s6. But i'll tell you what I have got saved in the bitz box. GI Joe (Action Force in UK) had a chinook-esque helicopter called a tomahawk - with an awesome chin gun with a gatling cannon on. The turret ring would sit nicely on the back hatch. think the M111 with the vulcan on...

That would make a good base. How much does the toy cost?

Denzark
09-22-2009, 01:08 AM
That would make a good base. How much does the toy cost?

I managed to get 2 off the bay of E - less than $10 a pop I seem to remember.

Aldramelech
09-22-2009, 02:52 AM
Ta, I'll look into that too