Convince Me Not to Leave Cygnar

[ElectricPaladin]

My Boys in Blue are having a hard time of it.

Whenever I bring my Cygnar to the table, I end up losing horribly, feeling as though I had no chance. I never seem to have enough Focus to do anything - everyone else's 'jacks seem more focus-efficient than mine. My models don't seem to hit hard enough to achieve anything. My mobility always seems to fail before my opponent's superior speed.

It isn't the same with my Everblight. I mean, I'm still a relatively new player - I still lose a lot - but I usually feel like I've put a dent in my opponent's forces. I may not get Absylonia or some other deadly model into an angle to attempt an assassination, or the assassination might not always succeed, but at least I manage to wipe out a swath of my opponent's infantry and make him sweat trying to take out Typhon. Not so with my Cygnar, where I usually just feel ineffective. It's gotten to the point that I haven't even finished painting any of my Cygnar. It just doesn't seem worth it.

And now, I'm looking at my blue-primed lightning coils and thinking "I could probably trade these guys in and take a stab at Mercs, or Cryx - I really, really like the look of the Witch Coven - or even just buy more Everblight" and it makes me kind of sad. I want to keep at least one, vaguely heroic faction in my army bag!

So, talk me up here. Give me advice, help me figure out what I'm doing wrong, or just plain remind me why Cygnar is cool. Convince me to keep my boys in blue.

[Jack-Hammer]

In my meta Cygnar is fearsome faction. There are two players who both use a mixed approach to their lists. Lots of good quality ranged and a solid centre, usually featuring the stormclad. From the games I've played vs them I'd say Cygnar is a competitive faction. Often their game plan is obvious as they don't have many tricks but you cant stop them shooting a buffing up their models.

I dont know how long you've been playing but I'd say stick with 'em. Learn their style. Do you have they key power pieces? B-13, long gunners, stromclad, 'seige', the haleys, estryker?

And lets not forget the rule of cool. Cygnar does have some of the nicest looking models IMHO. I play hordes but when I get a warmachine faction I'm getting Cygnar.

[Dais]

I've been there before - I've seen all of the issues you have too and I can't say I solved all of them, but I worked around a few. Cygnar is not an easy faction to win with right now, but I'm guessing you didn't pick them up in the first place because you wanted an easy button army. Most of what I post you'll probably already know, but maybe it will all help give better perspective seeing it in context.
Cygnar has a reputation as a shooting army but in mk2 this isn't so much the case any more, we have the best shooting but ret, mercs, khador, and even menoth stepped up their ranged game. You can't build a full gunline and expect to win though, I find mixed lists of ranged/melee jacks/infantry perform best.
What Cygnar has going for it is high average accuracy and crazy targeting options like all the chain lightning guns and electro leaps we've been getting recently. The stormcaller even has an attack that isn't an attack. The way the army is set up right now it mostly has assassination tools with just a few attrition models to keep things going in scenarios, but as you mentioned, some of the tools are only at the basic level. Still, even if only at basic levels, you do at a broad array of tools so try setting up multiple ways to get your hits in. In my best list I have a ranged assassination, a melee assassination, and thorn running in for Haley to use combat channeling all as win conditions. Cygnar casters are also considered some of the best from all factions, but also a bit focus-starved so deciding how you need to support your army to go for the win is very important, you usually have to decide early on and stick with it for most of the game.
As for the comparison to everblight - Right now fury is considered to have a noticeable advantage over focus and that is driving many WM players into tough spots or making them opt to go infantry heavy. I think your experience is magnified since you see both sides of this at once.
I don't know your favored casters or what kind of collection you have so my only advice is to try casters like estrker and kraye if you haven't already, or trade off the stuff you enjoy the least for some highborn mercs. Even if you go back to cygnar the entire highborn covenant works for them so your losing nothing but postage. You can also double-dip gun mages , precursors, and Galant. I recommend the Nyss hunters even for cygnar, hunter is a crucial ranged ability the faction lacks and their combined arms style works well with the faction -particularly with Murdoch added on.

[Vinsklortho]

Cygnar has some of the most fearsome infantry clearing I've seen in a faction which is pretty great considering how a lot of armies tend to run quite infantry heavy. Cygnar has some of the scariest warcasters in the entire game. Put eCaine or either of the Haleys on the table and watch your opponent's heart sink. As far as Jacks go Cygnar probably runs Jacks second only to Menoth in efficiency. With access to so many quality Jack marshalls, Arlan Strangeways, and spells from your casters you can do amazing things.

Cygnar is probably my next faction in the queue after I get the last few things I need for my Menoth army. Also, IIRC Cygnar won the last big Masters and/or Hardcore tourney with eCaine.

[scadugenga]

You can't play Cygnar the same way you do Legion and hope to win.

Cygnar is all about maximizing efficiency.

You have the best ranged warcasters in the game. (Both Caine's, Kraye and the grand majestryx of them all, Kara Sloan.

Sloan, with her feat, and Reinholt gets 3 shots in one turn. 3.

Rolling 12 + 4d6 (boosted) on each is horrifying for opponents.

You have the Cyclone for area denial/infantry removal. The Centurian for beatsticking it. Journeyman warcaster solos that can cast arcane shield...

Trenchers are def 17 dug in, immune to blast damage, w/CRA. Put snipe on them, and the're a threat at range. Add the piper to make them fearless/tough, and they become almost immovable.

You have the Storm Strider--the coolest damn war engine around.

Cygnar plays very differently than the other factions. You just have to adapt your playing style. Ret is nasty, yes. You know what they hate? arcane tempest gun mages who ignore stealth. :)

[Eyespy]

And lets not forget the rule of cool. Cygnar does have some of the nicest looking models IMHO.

This is why I picked cygnar, and its why I kept them.

Really the whole game is about experimentation. If you bring the same list all the time, then its really no surprise you get beat (sorry but its true), not to mention a wining list is heavily meta dependant, so its something you have to figure for yourself.

[j78]

do you use alot of mercs in your cygnar? that might be the easiest thing to do at this point. add more mercs. if it works, you are doing well, if not, you're halfway to a merc list.

[whitestar333]

Cygnar is quite the challenging faction because we have so many cool tools at our disposal, but our toys are expensive and usually quite fragile. With Cygnar the battle is about positioning and optimization and the warcaster is usually more supportive than other factions. We're also a faction that needs to supplement with Mercs probably more than most factions, since we don't actually have our own heavy infantry.

Some things to consider:
1) Try some of the less popular warcasters and get a feel for how they do well. Sometimes playing other warcasters will enlighten you on how to use a unit differently. Consider trying out either Nemo, Darius, or Kraye if you want to see Cygnar warjacks at their finest.
2) Play against different factions. Sometimes the game can really suffer from rocks-paper-scissors and while Cygnar has better answers to most factions, you can sometimes get the "grass is always greener" attitude about them. Legion and Cryx have their own set of challenges and difficulties to face.
3) Try asking a friend if you could swap lists with them for a game, let them try Cygnar while you try their army. This way you can see how someone else plays your army and you can get a feel for another faction without spending any money. You need to make sure you're pretty good friends with them, however.
4) Have a friend write a list for you. Sometimes a friend might be able to see some strange synergy that you might overlook or they might have an idea for you to try. Keep your mind open and don't get discouraged!

Warmachine/Hordes is a challenging game - not because the rules are difficult, but because the game has an incredible amount of depth to it and there's always something new to try or learn.

[j78]

don't leave, you can bring a support solo

http://privateerpress.com/warmachine/gallery/cygnar/warcasters/artificer-general-nemo-epic-warcaster-and-storm-chaser-adept-ca

[ElectricPaladin]

don't leave, you can bring a support solo

http://privateerpress.com/warmachine/gallery/cygnar/warcasters/artificer-general-nemo-epic-warcaster-and-storm-chaser-adept-ca

The tough love I was getting on the PP forums did it and I'm back to painting my Cygnar (starting with the stuff I'll be using in my Kraye list), but damn... those are gorgeous.

Ok. I win. I'm sticking with Cygnar.

[Vinsklortho]

You have the best ranged warcasters in the game. (Both Caine's, Kraye and the grand majestryx of them all, Kara Sloan.

Sloan, with her feat, and Reinholt gets 3 shots in one turn. 3.

Rolling 12 + 4d6 (boosted) on each is horrifying for opponents.

I tried a game with Cygnar using Kara Sloan on Vassal and dang is she fun. She does quite a bit to buff her army and I ended up winning the game by putting two Spitfire rounds into Ravyn.

[possiblyarowbot]

Cygnar is tricky to get the hang of, but once you do, holy cow. You can't really compare Cygnar with Legion as most-people-who- don't-play-legion agree, the faction is overpowered.

You don't have to play the ranged game with cygnar either. They have a ton of lightning themed minis and my friend, who plays both cygnar and legion, plays only lightning support.

Plus, if you think Cygnar is hard, Mercs and Ret are master level tricky.

[Martin_Fierro]

Glad to hear it! One of the things I've really enjoyed about MkII are the theme lists. There are some really fun bonuses. I'm also really enjoying the lightning models and some of the fun/interesting interactions, like Storm Striders and the Storm artillery (forgot what it's called). I'm really looking forward to getting a Storm Strider to go with my two Storm Towers which'll boost them up to RAT9!

[Quattro]

Good to hear you're sticking with big blue. I've been playing since MK1, but the one thing I've always noticed with Cygnar is they don't necessarily have a easy button, there are very few things that are the always auto include. I think list building seems to matter a lot more than other factions. That being said lighting is always if you do get a little tired of them it's always fun to run a Magnus Bad Seed list, that's 85% Cygnar.

[the_puritan]

Mages with guns.
That's all there is to it... and all there needs to be, really.