GK Nemesis force weapons

[Dalleron]

I got involved in a discussion regarding nemesis dreadfists on another forum.

Someone asked if a Dreadknight could use it's force weapon to insta-gib 2 Monstrous Creatures. I would say no, as that goes against force wpn rules.

Am I wrong in saying that applies to the dreadknight. Or does it being a GK unit allow all of his attacks to become attacks that cause Instant death just by passing it's psychic test? Is that really how GK force weapons work? One model could kill multiple multi wound models by splitting his attacks?

[BS FADE]

From what I understand you have to have be a unit with brotherhood of psykers to activate and make all force weapon wounds instant death. Look on the first page of Wargear where it talks about Force weapons inside the big box.

[DarkLink]

Grey Knight force weapons follow the rules in the BRB for force weapons, with a few modifications. A unit with The Brotherhood of Psykers rule inflicts ID with all of its attacks.

But, Dreadknights do not have the Brotherhood of Psykers rule, so this is not the case.

[Dalleron]

I know that is what the codex says, and was trying to get my point across using those points, but some people just wont have any of it. Ignorance truly is bliss, more so when you are a GK player I guess.

[karlthepagan]

The Nemessis Force Weapon text reads differently than the BRB text and is much clearer.

[Hiflt4]

the dreadknight can only gib one model, where as the squad can gib one per weapon assuming you keep careful track of wound allocation.

[SeattleDV8]

the dreadknight can only gib one model, where as the squad can gib one per weapon assuming you keep careful track of wound allocation.

There is no restriction to the number of models which can be destroyed by the squad.
GK Codex, pg. 54
..all wounds caused by the unit's Nemesis force weapons that phase inflict instant death.
Unlike the Dreadknight which is limited.

[Yayula]

I've only played a few times vs GKs, and only gave the codex a quick scan, but yeah, the dreadknight would only be able to activate de nemesis force weapon if he didn't use any other psy tests before, or if he is a lvl2 psyker which i really don't know he might activate it twice. The functionality of NFW for units w/o the brotherhood of psykers is that they must spend 1 psy power to activate them.

Not a GK example but a sorcerer of tzeentch might kill 2 units with his force weapons since he is able to cast two spells due to the MoT.

[CajunMan]

Ya he can only get one like other forceweapons.

[Rapture]

Yeah what they said. +1

This is going to be a rough month...

[DarkLink]

where as the squad can gib one per weapon assuming you keep careful track of wound allocation.

Wrong, because of the Nemesis Force Weapon and Brotherhood of Psyker rules.

Every. Single. Attack. Inflicts. Instant. Death.

[Dalleron]

The GK BoP rule is clear as how it relates to Force weapon usage.

As an update to the thread I was talking about. This person who posed the question on another forum took the answer he got in reply to his thread, and tried to use it in the real world at his local GW. Apparently he was not very successful in trying to use a force weapon to insta-kill 2 models.

Regarding the MoTzeentch. I know that model with that mark can use 2 psychic powers a turn, but as far as I know, you can't use the same power twice, unless it specifically says so.

[gendoikari87]

Wrong, because of the Nemesis Force Weapon and Brotherhood of Psyker rules.

Every. Single. Attack. Inflicts. Instant. Death.

this it's clearly worded.

[DarkLink]

Right, it's now a universal thing that you cannot use the same psychic power twice per turn, period. This is also important in that if you fail a particular power (e.g. Sanctuary with Coteaz or a Librarian) you cannot re-attempt it even if you have a spare power left to use.

[Sonikgav]

Nemesis Force Weapons are Forceweapons however as the additional states ALL wounds caused by a NFW cause instant death. The Brotherhood rule is only referenced to indicate what happens with units of multiple forceweapons.

The Dreadknight (as the Original thread relates to) can one shot kill as many Monstrous creatures as it can wound. Yes it makes the GK's that little bit more broken but the Brotherhood rule has no bearing on Nemesis Force Weapons other than how whole units activate them.

[Wildcard]

Actually, what Sonigav says its true: (p.54 GK dex)


Nemesis Force Weapons
Force weapons: All Nemesis weapons are force weapons, as detailed in the "Wh40k rulebook". Note that a unit of Grey Knights with the Brotherhood of Psykers special rule needs to take only a single Psychic test to 'activate' all of its force weapons (although independent characters must still roll separately). If the test is passed, all wounds caused by the unit's Nemesis force weapons that phase inflict instand death.


There is only a special notation for the squad with brotherhood of psykers special rule that they have to take a single test (and not 5-10 etc..)

The last sentence is the most relevant here: No mater who is using it, (Captain, GK strike squad member, Inquisitor, dreadnought or dreadknight, after successfull activation, all wounds caused by the wielder are causing instant death.

(I admit that i had to check this out myself, and i have never played as it seems to be written)

That said, I wouldn't care for one dreadknight, think of a captain, or champion:

Champion re-rolls hits and wounds, and makes a strike against every model in b2b contact, thats easily 5 small bases, or atleast 3 terminator-size bases, upon one test, all causing instant death..
Same with the Captain (or grand master), lots of attacks, high weapon skill (can get master crafted weapon) mostly strikes first against models that have W2+, again, upon one ld10 test, all are causing ID

[Sonikgav]

Its most evident vs units of Multiwound infantry. Ork Nobs or Tyranid Warriors etc. One guy can shred chunks out of whole units. Whole units of NFW's are just painfull against these arent even fair.