1500 Tournament Space Marines

[Chexmix282]

With an upcoming 1500 point tournament in my area, It's time to decide what to take. My first thought was lots of Las/Plas Razorbacks, 3 Vindicators, and a Null Zone Libby but it evolved into this:


HQ
Librarian 100
-Null Zone, The Avenger

Elites
5 Terminators 235
-Cyclone Missile Launcher, Chainfist

5 Terminators 235
-Cyclone Missile Launcher, Chainfist

Troops
10 Tactical Marines 210
-Meltagun, Multi-Melta, Rhino

10 Tactical Marines 210
-Meltagun, Multi-Melta, Rhino

5 Tactical Marines 165
-Razorback w/ Lascannon, TL Plasmagun

Heavy Support
Vindicator 115

Vindicator 115

Vindicator 115

1500

The Libby stays in the Razorback behind the 3 Vindicators, while the Tactical Squads (in Rhinos) flank the Vindicators, protecting their weak side armor. The Terminators provide suppressing fire while also fufilling a counter-assault role.

Any suggestions, or potential tough matchups? I usually play tournaments at 2k so 1500 is a bit odd for me.

[Tynskel]

I would replace one terminator squad with either vanguard or assault marines. have them hide behind your 'shield' wall. Also, I highly recommend siege shields. Vindicators that can always move through terrain are awesome.

[Wolfshade]

I quite like this list, my only concern would be the lack of range everything is 24"

[Chexmix282]

I could replace a Terminator Squad with 10 Assault Marines w/ Power Fist, and with the extra points add Combi-Meltas to each Tactical Squad. I just seriously doubt the effectiveness of Assault Marines without FC/FNP... so I don't think i will do that. Siege Shields would be awesome but I don't have the points.

I think I will be fine regarding range, though, as I do have 5 S8-9 shots at 48". The army is designed to kill stuff within Null Zone range anyway, lol.

[Chexmix282]

After a bit of tweaking, I cam up with another variant that I believe is a bit better.

HQ
Librarian 100
-Null Zone, The Avenger

Elites
10 Terminators 465
-2 Cyclone Missile Launchers, Chainfist

Troops
10 Tactical Marines 220
-Meltagun, Combi-Melta, Missile Launcher, Rhino

10 Tactical Marines 220
-Meltagun, Combi-Melta, Missile Launcher, Rhino

Fast Attack
Attack Bike 50
-Multi-Melta

Attack Bike 50
-Multi-Melta

Attack Bike 50
-Multi-Melta

Heavy Support
Vindicator 115

Vindicator 115

Vindicator 115

1500


The Tactical Marines will combat squad, leaving the Missile Launcher halves to sit on objectives and provide fire support. The Melta/Combi-Melta teams will be in the Rhinos, flanking the Vindicators as mentioned above. The Terminators will also combat squad, flanking the Rhinos. The Attack Bikes hide behind the Vindicators until a target presents itself.

Thoughts on this list compared to the original? This list has a bit more long range firepower (6 S8 vs 4 S8 and 1 S9) but has a lot more melta.

[Mr. Pickles]

Attack bikes=kill points

I know they are an extremely good MSU unit, but you already are heavy on kill points. You may want to change them out for five man assault squad in a rhino. They are really cheap and they can have two meltas as well (I think). In KP the attack bikes will be nuked by heavy ordnance shooting at your vindicators. That is a potential two for one.

[Wolfshade]

I would say Attack Bikes are perhaps my favourite fast attack choice in codex space marine, they are cheap effective and so often get within 12" of armour..

[Chexmix282]

Assault Squads in the SM dex do not get meltaguns at all, so that would not work unfortunately. I am not worried about how many kill points my list has to offer, as it can be easily mitigated by playing defensively with them.

I COULD do a 5-man Sternguard squad with 2 meltas in a Rhino, but that is 170 points. I don't think dropping the Combi-Meltas on the Tactical Squads (the only way to get those points without drastic changes) and the Attack Bikes is worth it, as I would be losing quite a bit of firepower.

Are there any lists that you think this army would have a tough time facing?

[Wolfshade]

I think it is a nice well rounded list. It is hard to say what you would have difficulties facing because that starts one thinking of making lists purely designed to take this list out, which isn't very helpful. The lists that spring to mind are those pure close combat lists if they can get within assault range there isn't much of counter. But, from the list it looks highly mobile to keep to keep all the units out of combat. Then there are also the swarm lists which marines can sometimes struggle against purely based on there relavtively high cost/model.

[Tiberian]

The only thing I have to gripe about is the Multi meltas later missile launchers in the tac marine squads, how many turns are you really going to be stationary so you can fire your one heavy weapon in each squad.

[AlMalik]

Two squads of Terminators would be more mobile.

[Vashtek]

I like the list. I'd be interested to know how you get on

Minor comments:

I would lose the multimeltas and take missile launchers with the tac squads. The missed turn of shooting to get in range is really bad. I like multimeltas in drop pods, but not in rhinos. Several lists don't need to come to you and you already have a bunch of vindicators and attack bikes who will be hogging the 24" range. It will be nice for you to have 1 or 2 combat squads to sit far away on a home objective and blow up stuff like dark eldar raiders and chimeras before your vindicators open up.

Is the avenger psychic power really working for you? It's never really worked for me. I'd consider gate to infinity or whatever it's called. This way you can teleport a combat squadded tac squad with melta/combi melta and toast tanks. It also really helps in objective games.

[Vashtek]

Two squads of Terminators would be more mobile.

Really no need as he can combat squad if it's not a victory point game

[Chexmix282]

I always combat squad the Terminators, so there is no need to take them in two units. I prefer only having one power sword between then 10 models anyway, and taking 2 units would force me to put a power sword in each unit.

after playing a few games I have decided to stick to Missile Launchers on the Tacticals, and I will almost always combat squad them to leave the Missile Launcher half in my deployment zone.

Out of the games I've played with this army, I've only fired Avenger once. I will likely swap it out for Gate.

EDIT: Here's the new list. I wasn't a fan of the Razorback.

HQ
Librarian 100
-Null Zone, Gate of infinity

Elites
10 Terminators 460
-2 Cyclone Missile Launchers

Troops
Tactical Squad 220
-Meltagun, Combi-Melta, Missile Launcher, Rhino

Tactical Squad 220
-Meltagun, Combi-Melta, Missile Launcher, Rhino

Fast Attack
Land Speeder 70
-Multi-Melta, Heavy Flamer

Land Speeder 70
-Multi-Melta, Heavy Flamer

Heavy Support
Vindicator 120
-Dozer Blade

Vindicator 120
-Dozer Blade

Vindicator 120
-Dozer Blade

1500

The other option would be to exchange the 2 Land Speeders and 3 Dozer Blades for 5 Scouts with a Combi-Melta and a Land Speeder Storm with Heavy Flamer. Which one would be recommended? I would prefer the Land Speeders for more shots, but I could also use the additional scoring unit.

[Vashtek]

I always combat squad the Terminators, so there is no need to take them in two units. I prefer only having one power sword between then 10 models anyway, and taking 2 units would force me to put a power sword in each unit.

after playing a few games I have decided to stick to Missile Launchers on the Tacticals, and I will almost always combat squad them to leave the Missile Launcher half in my deployment zone.

Out of the games I've played with this army, I've only fired Avenger once. I will likely swap it out for Gate.

EDIT: Here's the new list. I wasn't a fan of the Razorback.

HQ
Librarian 100
-Null Zone, Gate of infinity

Elites
10 Terminators 460
-2 Cyclone Missile Launchers

Troops
Tactical Squad 220
-Meltagun, Combi-Melta, Missile Launcher, Rhino

Tactical Squad 220
-Meltagun, Combi-Melta, Missile Launcher, Rhino

Fast Attack
Land Speeder 70
-Multi-Melta, Heavy Flamer

Land Speeder 70
-Multi-Melta, Heavy Flamer

Heavy Support
Vindicator 120
-Dozer Blade

Vindicator 120
-Dozer Blade

Vindicator 120
-Dozer Blade

1500

The other option would be to exchange the 2 Land Speeders and 3 Dozer Blades for 5 Scouts with a Combi-Melta and a Land Speeder Storm with Heavy Flamer. Which one would be recommended? I would prefer the Land Speeders for more shots, but I could also use the additional scoring unit.

It really depends on your metagame and if everyone is taking land raiders or rhinos, but consider typhoons instead of melta- speeders. The melta speeders fire half as many shots, and have a much reduced range. The +1 to damage chart is nice, but the typhoon will roll on the chart more often, and from a safer distance. It's all personal preference, but I've found typhoons to be more useful. I wouldn't say that adding a scout squad is increasing your troops, because the scout squad will not last past turn 2. I'd only recommend using them in an alpha strike kind of list with say shrike and assault terminators and/or assault marines.

Your lack of troops is an issue, however. I would consider the following list:


Librarian nullzone, gate 100

TROOPS
Marine Squad I : 5x extra marines missile launcher melta gun combi melta 185
Razorback - twin plas/lascannon 75

Marine Squad II: 5x extra marines missile launcher melta gun combi melta 185
Razorback - twin plas/lascannon 75

Marine Squad III: 5x extra marines missile launcher plasma gun combi plasma 190
Razorback - twin plas/lascannon 75

Fast atttack
Typhoon 90
Typhoon 90
Typhoon 90

HEAVY SUPPORT
Vindicator 115
Vindicator 115
Vindicator 115

Possibly swap one of the razorbacks for a rhino and give a sergeant a powerfist. That way you have a sort of assault force if you need it against e.g. imperial guard. You will combat squad in most games, so having rhinos isn't really required, and you can always use gate anyway.

This gives you a bunch of firepower and your guys are nicely meched up. It should be dificult for an opponent to deal with all the shooting you have available and you have decent options against hordes and elites.