and the rumors go on.........

[Mr. Swaggle]

Hello friends!

I have some information that I have gathered from a source that is yet to be proven reliable but I thought I would share with the community.

As a dedicated Tau player I was disappointed to find my blue men will not release this year, nor will BT or DA. Evidently there will only be two armies released this year.

From what I "overheard" the summer release is supposed to be Chaos/CSM and Eldar. I know sounds nuts. But the spring is going to be one of those two with the other followed in the winter/fall. Again I do not know how this makes since but it is GW so all is fair.

The reasoning I picked up was that GW wanted two big releases this year to coincide with anniversary. I found it strange though that it wouldnt be marines or orks but heh!

Besides that though the releases are supposed to be the largest to date with something like 80% of the new models released upon arrival.


I also got that 2013 will see Tau and orks, with a huge space marine book. All three of those armies (huge grain of salt) will also be getting a large holiday battalion box.

Also DA will get summer White Dwarfed in 2013 and BT will be in marine book.

Besides that I dont know how much stock I put in these rumors but I thought it was worth bringing up. Also I purposely created this logon just so I wouldnt be harrassed by an angry mob of gamers (we all do it)

[Deadlift]

No kind of loyalist space marine release this year ? This alone surprises me.

[StraightSilver]

I may live to regret this, but there will be no Eldar release in 2012.

They are still a long way off, at least a year away from what I have been told.

of course now I have said that I will probably be proved wrong, but I am 99% sure they won't be this year.

Tau on the other hand are a strong contender, although they have had models ready to go for over a year and still haven't shown up.

2012 looks like this as far as I know:

February: Nids Wave
March: Necron Wave

June: Chaos Legions
July: 6th Edition boxed ste (featuring Dark Angels and Chaos)
August: Codex Dark Angels

There are no signs of any other Codex releases, there may be waves for other armies.

Q4 this year will be dominated by the Hobbit so expect Q2 and Q3 to be 40K centric, but don't expect too much.

Then Q1 2013 will be more Hobbit, Q2 2013 may see a new Codex but it's more likely to be wave releases, so if Eldar or Tau were coming I would say Q3.

Of course I may be wrong, but these are the indications I have been told.

Then again, one of those sources said Tau were due before Necrons, so who knows....

[celestialatc]

So many rumors! Which to believe!?

[Wrath]

So many rumors! Which to believe!?

none? They are rumors. Just possible futures. Things to discuss until the next release.

[energongoodie]

Trust no one.

[GrenAcid]

I may live to regret this, but there will be no Eldar release in 2012.

They are still a long way off, at least a year away from what I have been told.

of course now I have said that I will probably be proved wrong, but I am 99% sure they won't be this year.

Tau on the other hand are a strong contender, although they have had models ready to go for over a year and still haven't shown up.

2012 looks like this as far as I know:

February: Nids Wave
March: Necron Wave

June: Chaos Legions
July: 6th Edition boxed ste (featuring Dark Angels and Chaos)
August: Codex Dark Angels

There are no signs of any other Codex releases, there may be waves for other armies.

Q4 this year will be dominated by the Hobbit so expect Q2 and Q3 to be 40K centric, but don't expect too much.

Then Q1 2013 will be more Hobbit, Q2 2013 may see a new Codex but it's more likely to be wave releases, so if Eldar or Tau were coming I would say Q3.

Of course I may be wrong, but these are the indications I have been told.

Then again, one of those sources said Tau were due before Necrons, so who knows....


Ekhm...sir, is 6th of Feb.

[GrenAcid]

Trust no one.
Not even yourself....especially yourself.

Sory I had to do it.

[energongoodie]

Not even yourself....especially yourself.

Sory I had to do it.

Agreed ;)

[lattd]

Ekhm...sir, is 6th of Feb.

Remeber GW has started doing 2 release windows per month.

[StraightSilver]

It is indeed 6th February, but next advance orders go up on 25th February and March WD comes out same day, so I supopse technically it's a March release but it wil be announced in Feb.

Of course people may be telling me absolute nonsense, but rumours are rumours so it isn't worth believeing anybody 100%.

I do know that most releases have a 2 year lead time in terms of development.

When I last spoke to Jes Goodwin he hadn't even started Eldar yet, and at the time they were still finishing off DE and trying to work out what to do with SOB which had hit development hell.

Jes said that DE had got him all fired up for Eldar again, which implied he wanted to go to town on them like he did with DE, which took 5 years to develop.

I'm not saying Eldar will be that far off, but even if they were started immediately after DE (which they weren't) they would still be at least a year away, so I would say the chances of seeing them this year is slim.

Of course that doesn't mean GW couldn't just release a new Codex and release a minimal amount of miniatures but I think that unlikely.

Nids on the other hand were started wel over 2 years ago and still have minis to come, may or not be Feb but Necrons are supposedly March and Nids are said to be before them.

Who knows, I don't doubt I will be proved wrong shortly......

[isotope99]

The second one was usually previewed in the WD though and this month is LOTR only (except the 25th an model).

Putting together the latest rumours I've seen (mostly from Warseer), and extrapolatring a bit from previous release patterns, best guess is:

March: Nids (possibly Space Wolves?)
April: Fantasy (possibly Empire)
May: Necrons (possibly Space Wolves?)
June: Fantasy (possibly Dwarves models)
July: 6Ed book
August: Chaos/Fantasy
September: 6Ed box
October: Chaos/Fantasy
November: Hobbit
December: Christmas/Hobbit

[DrLove42]

I can see two waves, Necs and Nids in March, then the WD having a battle rep between the 2 of them. Would be nice if they actually released some 40k models other than 1 marine the months around the anniversary

[Wildcard]

With all the releases coming, what happened t to the rumours of Imperial Guard releases?

- Veterans multipart-plastic boxed set
- dual kit artillery (some form of mortar / hydra)

Sad panda waits for carapace cannonfodder :(

[Galadren]

BT will be in marine book.


I may be biased, but I buried this thing in salt with that right there. After six years of having a completely different army make up from Codex: Space Marines there is no way GW would say "Hey, you guys have Tactical squads and Scout companies again!"

[Dalleron]

Ya, because GW has never messed with their backstory for anything.

[MarneusCalgar]

I will take all of these with a huge mountain of salt...

[Galadren]

Ya, because GW has never messed with their backstory for anything.

No, but they wouldn't create an entire army and play style then just shuffle it back in and say "we didn't do that" either. At least they haven't yet. Even Sisters got a White Dwarf update.

[DarkLink]

It would be really nice if GW figured out there were other codices out there other than Marines. The differences between 'Marines with Land Raiders' and 'Marines with bikes' and 'Marines with giant wolves' aren't nearly as great as the differences between Tau or Eldar or 'nidz or orks or IG or Sisters. All it would take is a little creativity, and one could condense all the Marine codices other than Grey Knights into one book with no real loss of individual flavor. That would be one thick codex, though.

[Deadlift]

Its certainly been a lack luster start to the year for me personally, non to keen on lotr and 1 average space marine model to celebrate 25 years of 40k. I know its only February but cmon, GW could have given us something a little more exciting to start this quarter of a century anniversary of 40k

[Malachi]

It would be really nice if GW figured out there were other codices out there other than Marines. The differences between 'Marines with Land Raiders' and 'Marines with bikes' and 'Marines with giant wolves' aren't nearly as great as the differences between Tau or Eldar or 'nidz or orks or IG or Sisters. All it would take is a little creativity, and one could condense all the Marine codices other than Grey Knights into one book with no real loss of individual flavor. That would be one thick codex, though.

I agree on the "differences aren't as great" point, but not on the "can be combined with no real loss of flavor" point. However, point to what was done with Dark Eldar and Necrons does show that GW is willing to commit a great deal of time and effort in, at least, attempting to make non-Marine (indeed non-Imperium) armies interesting and viable.

[DarkLink]

I agree on the "differences aren't as great" point, but not on the "can be combined with no real loss of flavor" point.

As far as the rules are concerned? I call bull****.

90% of every single Marine codex is a virtual copy/paste, excluding Grey Knights. Yes, sometimes a unit will have just a bolter/bolt pistol, while sometimes they also get a CCW. Sometimes a tactical Marine is 16pts, sometimes they're 15. Those differences are negligible.

Look at what is actually different between the Marine codices. Each codex has some special characters, and each codex has a couple of unique units. Fine, that's easy to include in one book. You simply force the player to pick a chapter, and they unlock that chapter's characters and special units. Simple.

Some of the codices have unique FOC tricks. BA can take assault Marines as troops. DA gets Terminators as troops. Again, simply force the player to pick a chapter to unlock said FOC swaps. Even easier to incorporate.

Then we have the unique special rules. BA get Fast Vehicles. SW get counter attack. BT have Righteous Zeal. DA have Stubborn. Etc. Well, guess what. The vanilla codex already has a mechanism, Chapter Tactics, that causes you to swap out special rules.


The groundwork for all of this is already set in place. I could throw together a document in a matter of days incorporating all the codices into one single book using the Chapter Tactics system, and most of that time would simply be spent copy/pasting and editing profiles.

And what haven't we covered? BT's Neophytes? No problem. If you select the BT chapter, you can add up to 10 scouts to tactical/assault squads. And they can all have BP/CCW.



Not only is it entirely feasible to put together a mega Marine codex, but it really isn't all that hard to do while retaining all the current options of the different books.


Edit:
And don't get me wrong, this would be one frikin' big book, especially if they tried to include all the unique fluff. And they would have to cut out a lot of fluff in all probability. But frankly, that's what the Black Library is for. Why would I read though a timeline of random events involving my army when I could read an actual book.

I'm just saying that, as far as the rules are concerned and how the army feels on the table, there's no reason you couldn't use the Chapter Tactics system to combine all the Marine rules into one single book. Except Grey Knights. I don't know how you could make that work, as they have so little in common with normal Marines beyond T4 and a 2/3+ armor save.

[Kawauso]

I dunno...aside from vehicles, Space Wolves don't really share any Codex-following Marine units. All of their infantry units (and cavalry/beasts) are unique. SW are almost as different from Codex Marines as GK are, in that regard.

While I see where you're going with the 'Chapter Tactics' system, I don't think it's as cut-and-dry as you seem to think it is. BA and DA would probably have an alright time of it, as they have relatively few really unique units in comparison. I still don't think it would work cramming them all into one book, though.

[DarkLink]

Really? Thunderwolves, regular wolves and Wolf Guard are their only truly unique infantry in that regard. Grey Hunters are just Tactical Marines with a second CCW and no sarge. Long Fangs are just Devestators with a cap of 6 dudes, but are better in ever possible way. SW Scouts are all just, well, scouts, but with close combat weapons instead of sniper rifles. Blood Claws and their like are just a mix between scouts and assault Marines/bikes.

They appear different, and they have lots of fancy sounding names, and they play differently because they get some unique rules, but they have a direct analog with codex units that wouldn't be that hard to bridge. Vanilla Devestators are only different from Long Fangs in that they kinda suck, whilst Long Fangs have been tweaked to removes the Devestators normal weaknesses (over priced and limited to one target a turn).


And SW are by far the most divergent codex other than Grey Knights. It's the trickiest to make work, and would require the most unique units. The rest of the armies, BT included, are much easier.

If it really comes down to it, maybe SW deserve their own codex if they can't be cleanly fit into the big book. But DA can. BA can. BT can. And I'd bet that SWs can, too.

[gcsmith]

Actually BT do not follow the Codex Astartes, to put them in the codex would be to spit in their eyes, BA at least follow the codex.

[Kawauso]

Really? Thunderwolves, regular wolves and Wolf Guard are their only truly unique infantry in that regard. Grey Hunters are just Tactical Marines with a second CCW and no sarge. Long Fangs are just Devestators with a cap of 6 dudes, but are better in ever possible way. SW Scouts are all just, well, scouts, but with close combat weapons instead of sniper rifles. Blood Claws and their like are just a mix between scouts and assault Marines/bikes.


With respect, Grey Hunters are analogous to Tacticals, sure. But they don't carry heavy weapons (hence two specials), and as such play differently.

Long Fangs are Devs, but the burden of heavy fire support falls more heavily on them than Devs, because they are the only infantry in the army that can carry heavy weapons. I imagine that, in addition to their split-fire ability, this is why they have a point reduction over regular Devs (too much of a reduction, I agree). In part this is made up for, however, by the inability to expand the squad beyond 6 models. They can't take advantage of ablative wounds.

Wolf Scouts are not just scouts. They're WS/BS 4 and have access to more special weapons, as well as Behind Enemy Lines. They're quite a bit more competent than normal Scouts (both in the fluff and on the tabletop).

Blood Claws are a mix between Scout and Assault Marines, yes. But they aren't either of those, really - and as such, that's another distinct unit entry.

And don't forget the army-wide lack of Combat Squads. It's a small difference, but it affects how the army functions quite a bit.

It's clear which SW units are analogous to which SM units, but it's apples and oranges as opposed to apples and apples. The unit analogs don't function the same and as a result the army plays/acts in a subtly but significantly different way.

I think BA and DA being added to the main Marine 'dex would work pretty easily...and it would at least make sense as they are Codex-following chapters.

SW and BT have identities that I think differ too much from Codex marines to be included in such a book. BT have less of this difference actually reflected in their codex, but I think that's just the age of the book showing. I would imagine (and hope) when they get an update their uniqueness would be expanded upon to make them as divergent as the wolves are now.

[Rev. Tiberius Jackhammer]

Actually BT do not follow the Codex Astartes, to put them in the codex would be to spit in their eyes, BA at least follow the codex.Wouldn't want to offend the space-men!

If a Crusader Squad, Emperor's Champion and some special characters could be unlocked for a "Black Templars" army which dropped some of the normal SM units (Scouts, Sternguards, Libbies), and granted all remaining units a Black Templar army special rule, they'd be pretty well represented.

[eldargal]

I used to favour the idea of a mega-Marine book, bu now I think folding DA, BT and a few others into an extra book and keeping the rest of the lineup the same would be better for GW if they go down that route. That way they won't annoy most existing SM players and you have one codex with lots of extra chapters instead of two books for two chapters (DA &BT).

[DarkLink]

Right, I'm not opposed to the idea of having a SW and BT list, then everything else all in one book. Removing even a few codices from the lineup will speed things up a fair amount. I just think it's perfectly feasible to combine them into one book. It wouldn't be a Codex: Codex Abiding Marines. It would be a Codex: All Marines. Some follow the Codex Atartes, some don't. You could do it either way.


And I fully agree that, due to subtle changes such as the lack of heavy weapons, Grey Hunters play differently from Tactical Marines. My point isn't that they play the same, just that the rules can be covered by one entry. Take a Tactical Squad unit entry, and at the bottom include "Grey Hunters use the Tactical Marine entry, but does not contain a Sergeant and may not take heavy weapons. In place of heavy weapons, they may take a second special weapon. Grey Hunters are also armed with a second CCW." Viola, you've replicated the main differences between Tactical Marines and Grey Hunters. By inserting a single sentence, you significantly compact the rules while retaining the things that make the units play differently. Same thing for most of the other SW units. They play differently, but only because of subtle variations on standard Marine units.

[Forever_Bunny]

I agree with DarkLink GW could make an all-in-one Space Marine Codex, but I think that they don't due to the fact the current format is still making them money.

Also one thing I keep seeing is power gamers mixing the DA rules with BA rules... Deathwing with Death company rules...[shutter].

[DarkLink]

You couldn't under the system I'm talking about. You'd either be playing DA, and get Terminators as troops, or you'd play BA and get Death Company. You can't do both. You only get to use the rules and special units from one chapter.

[helvexis]

so the choice would have to be dfined some way other than hq's because i could just take a belial type character and a blood angel type captain and voila i have ally forces ... i personally think it would be a great thing if you could do it like this but the potential for abuse is horrendous...

[Rev. Tiberius Jackhammer]

so the choice would have to be dfined some way other than hq's because i could just take a belial type character and a blood angel type captain and voila i have ally forces ... i personally think it would be a great thing if you could do it like this but the potential for abuse is horrendous...List a couple of army lists. A Blood Angels one, a Dark Angels one etc. They don't have rules, just show which unit is available and where it goes in the FOC. The player has to pick one of the army lists. There we go.

[helvexis]

yeah ok or keep havint to choose which chapter tactic you use and have chapter tactics include alot more than a special rule

though da having stubborn or tl plasma would be nice lol

[doogansquest]

Remeber GW has started doing 2 release windows per month.

Right, but that would have placed one of them in the White Dwarf release, and the only thing we saw even hinted at for Advanced Orders...wasn't related to the Tyranids in any way, shape, or form. Just a Necrons Battleforce.

Tyranids are likely in March.

[StraightSilver]

I'm afraid I am going to have retract my earlier rumours regarding release dates for 'Nids, Chaos and DA.

I had Choas down for June and DA for August, but it seems I am incapable of reading emails correctly so am now going to have to revise that. :)

I think i got a little bit over excited! :)

[keithsilva]

Man oh man I hope Eldar get released this summer, I will be one happy Eldar player:D:D

[StraightSilver]

This may mean nothing, but I got an email last night saying essentially that "there will be more than just cake and the Crimson Fist figure" in store on 25th Anniversary.

They also said "there will be some nice birthday presents for 40K players" in store that day.

That may not mean what I think it does, but it certainly backs up the rumour that 'Nids or Necrons will get a wave release at the end of February, maybe. :)

Or of course they may have been just talking about the stupid badges and mouse mats, but I don't think so.

[Wildeybeast]

But, if there was going to be a surprise release in store that day, why not announce it? They are desperate to get you into stores, so why not do a 'there willl be a very special surprise available in stores' announcement in WD? People are hardly going to flock into stores in droves on the off chance of a release based on a unsubtantiated rumour and conjecture (no offence to your rumour skills intended). I can't see them doing any new release without some sort of announcement, and since there is nothing in this months WD, I see it being more likely that this refers to something new in March's WD which will be released that day, rather than a wave coming that weekend.

[StraightSilver]

@ Wildeybeast: No offence taken at all, I must admit my rumour foo is pretty weak at the moment!! :)

It may well (and most probably) refer to the new WD that day, the email didn't actually refer to anything specific in store but that was the impression I got.

I don't think GW have ever sold something in store on the day it went up for pre-order so I suspect it may just be that you will be able to order stuff that day.

But the "birthday presents" comment implied that for that day GW would do something special for 40K fans in addition to what they advertsied in WD last month.

However it is more than possible I am just reading way too much into it, or my contact just wants me to go in a store that day. :)

[Wildeybeast]

Well, I hope they do produce something special in store, I've posted elsewhere about how I feel the 25th birthday celebrations are somewhat low key at the moment. But my feeling is, other than easily exicted kids and real hardcore fans, most gamers aren't going to be enticed into making a special trip to the store to get hold of a mousemat. They need to do a bit more promo work if they are really keen to get people into stores.

[gcsmith]

@ Wildeybeast: No offence taken at all, I must admit my rumour foo is pretty weak at the moment!! :)

It may well (and most probably) refer to the new WD that day, the email didn't actually refer to anything specific in store but that was the impression I got.

I don't think GW have ever sold something in store on the day it went up for pre-order so I suspect it may just be that you will be able to order stuff that day.

But the "birthday presents" comment implied that for that day GW would do something special for 40K fans in addition to what they advertsied in WD last month.

However it is more than possible I am just reading way too much into it, or my contact just wants me to go in a store that day. :)

Since I didn't receive such email from GW, is it possible its your stores birthday that weekend as well?

[StraightSilver]

The email wasn't from GW, it was from an ex-colleague who now works at GW HQ.

That doesn't mean it's any more reliable than coming from anybody else, but he did used to be spot on regarding forthcoming releases.

Not so much any more though, but that's because everybody is so bloody crytip or tight lipped! :)

[Strivos]

I will not take the OP's comments in mind at all until there is confirmation from someone that they are legit. 1 post doesn't cut it for me.


As for random postulation on what is going on in 6th I'd like to point out that the first codex that GW has released following a new edition of the rules for every edition since 2nd has been the generic marines. This serves a stabalizer to the environment as most people play marines and base their comparisons around them for 40k.

Similarly the fist codex realeased for the last couple editions for fantasy has been orcs and goblins.

So if I'm to guess from the buzz, specilation and past events is that either Chaos will be the last codex of 5th (similar to in the past) and the first new codex will be the basic marines and either followed by DA or have DA wrapped in, or the first codex will be marines likely with DA mixed in and followed by chaos.

The only one of those preditions I might lay money on is the marine dex coming out first in the new edition. Rummer mongers have been extra flaky this year.

I give credence only to 6th from the fact that we've seen a 6th edition rule set.

[MarneusCalgar]

Well, what it´s sure is that we are now in February and March is just round the corner, so we should start to see confirming images soon... no matter what the new miniatures are (necron, nids, wolves)

[Valhalla130]

All I can say is if they release a new SM codex, I hope that they spotlight a different marine chapter, other than Ultramarines. I believe the Imperial Fists are due for some codex love. They follow the Codex Astartes as much as Ultramarines. And it would be nice to see some other first founding legions highlighted, like Fists and White Scars.

[eldargal]

I doubt it, Ultramarines are the poster boy for codex Marines precisely because they fit the role so perfectly. Imperial Fists, while a codex chapter, still focus on siege warfare and have a few other differences. Also yellow is a pain in the bottom to paint well, I can't see GW putting yellow Marines in a starting kit. Blue is easy to paint in comparison.

[Dalleron]

Agreed.

I was painting a mangled ultra smurf for my FW avatar, and was amazed how easy it was to paint Ultramarines. By no means was it golden demon worthy but for about 5 minutes of work, it looked not bad.

Which is why Ultramarines make for a good starter set army and poster boy.

[flekkzo]

I doubt it, Ultramarines are the poster boy for codex Marines precisely because they fit the role so perfectly. Imperial Fists, while a codex chapter, still focus on siege warfare and have a few other differences. Also yellow is a pain in the bottom to paint well, I can't see GW putting yellow Marines in a starting kit. Blue is easy to paint in comparison.

As awesome as IFs are, yellow is a very difficult color to paint for beginners (not so much when you figure it out though, I paint yellow almost as easily/fast as blue now) while blue is just fantastically easy. White is also hard.

But what they could do is defocus the ultras a bit and include more background on all 1st founding chapters (that doesn't have their own codex) and make sure they have 2 special characters each. Some non-HQ special characters would be very nice for instance. That way the codex can be more "codex marines with Ultras as poster boys" rather than Ultramar! Ultramar! Ultramar!