IC Points - what percent of your army?

[Denzark]

Hey chaps

I'd be interested to see if anyone thinks there is an optimum points balance or percentage for ICs. Ie do you stick to 10% so Abaddon doesn't see light until 2750? Can you see Calgar or Eldrad in a 1500 pointer?:confused:

[Vince]

I almost always field 2 HQ choices. I dont set a rule like 10%. If the army is designed around Abaddon then I take him no matter the point cost. That being said I dont find a Abadon force to be the most optimal one.

[Gotthammer]

Every time I've faced eldar at 1500 they've had Eldrad.

I try not to spend more than around 150-200pts per IC for Marines, and usually only take one HQ. I prefer to field more troops.

[Aldramelech]

I field what I need. I do avoid Special Characters (40k and WFB), never liked them.

[RocketRollRebel]

Depending on the army and what the character does. For something like Imperial Guard I spend as little as possible on my IC's really. When I'm using my Blood Angels I'll spend 300pts on Dante and Corbulo just because of what they do for the guys around them. I'm not a fan of IC's like Abadon or Calgar because they may be killy guys but if I'm going to spend that many points then I want them to do something to boost the rest of my army. Lysander, Gazkull Thraka and Vulkan do a great job because they fulfill the killy and support roles which makes them IC's that are well worth the price tag IMO.

[The AKH]

I generally spend about 100 to 150 points on an IC in a 1000 point list... in 1500 points and above, I plan my lists with at least 300 points earmarked for my HQs.

[EmperorEternalXIX]

If I could it would be 0%.

Unfortunately the space marine codex has decided it will be 10-20% depending on my list size.

200 point leaders in 1000 point games suck.

[DarkLink]

In 1000pt games, I usually take a Brother captain with a psycannon (90~ points). When I hit 1500, I drop the psycannon and get a terminator retinue for him.

[ninja skills]

space marine hq's don't need to be expensive, just don't give them frills.

as i play daemons so its a mixed bag, heralds are nice and cheep 100 points nicely kitted out eg khorne herald on chariot with +1S but with greater daemons its 200-300 always, but who am to talk we get other people's hq choices as heavy support!

I'd just say go with what feels right to you try testing diferent options out until it feels right

[hereticus]

My current list runs 2 HQ's at just over 300 points total for 1750 (including the point-for-point best SC in the game). I don't run a set percentage though, just whatever feels right for the list I am building. Often, I only use 1 HQ and use the extra points on more troops.

[Foredrifter]

Well my Eldar army has two HQ's both Farseers on Jetbikes, so its around 300pts. A 5th of my total army pts.

Its quite alot, but I feel its worth!

/Rob

[slobulous]

I dont take any ICs with IG because of the CCS. 165 points for a chimera filled with plasma vets or 145 for melta vets. That's too much firepower for the cost to ignore! I always take 2, even in 1000.

[Lerra]

Depends a lot on the army. At 1500 points I like to have no more than 150 points of HQ and focus my points on a solid core of the army. For some armies the HQ is part of that solid core, though.

At 2k points, you can afford a lot more points of HQ in any army. I've got about 350 points of HQ at 2k.

[Herald of Nurgle]

Core of my force is a 20% HQ - always a Chaos Lord in Terminator Armour of some sort. I trade the Nurgle one for Typhus in a larger game/when opponent requests.
35% is then composed of Troops - usually Plague Marines.
25% is Elites such as Terminators.
10% Heavy and 10% Fast to finish the list off.

[EmperorEternalXIX]

As little as possible. Independent Characters are generally a bad idea for most armies, I feel. The Space Marine codex has most of their characters nerfed to worthlessness relative to their points cost; an Eldrad or a Farseer on a Bike will do a hell of a lot more for your army then a 190 point Librarian with 2 attacks and 2 wounds.

The worth of the SM HQ choices notwithstanding, there isn't a single dude with 3 wounds in this game worth 300 points, and there never was. So generally I keep it as cheap as possible, but ultimately I shoot for less than 200. The only character I would ever take that costs more than that are the guys from the Angels codex releases, as their SCs are a lot more effective overall. Otherwise, no character or IC is good enough that he should be representing a fifth or more of your entire army. I don't take Land Raiders in my lists for this same reason; the idea that one vehicle will win you the game is stupid, and it's too expensive to take more than one unless you are a total idiot.

I know a guy who runs a Vulkan list with THSS Terminators inside a Land Raider with 2 ICs, Vulkan and a similarly geared Captain. The Squad is gross, but it you avoid it (or somehow manage to destroy it), his game is pretty much over. He has two tactical squads, a dreadnought or two, and some speeders, and that is really it. He has told us that this squad amounts to over 700 points at times. That is my entire troops allotment in my lists. He wins a lot, but he also loses a lot to canny players. The "Death Star" unit notwithstanding.

I am reputed in my area for often saying that I wish I didn't have to take an HQ slot, or that I wish I could just take a Command Squad or Honor Guard instead. I am planning on switching over to the Space Wolves soon for various other reasons (mainly fluff and flexibility of the army's core forces), but chief among them is the option for dirt cheap HQs that are comparable to the more expensive+less useful+less combat-worthy Space Marine ones.

10 Wounds and 20 bolter rounds will help me a lot more than 3 base attacks on a terminator armored IC that stops sweeps. Probably the worth part about ICs is the simple fact that they die so easily; many of the SM ones do not have eternal warrior (which I agree with), but in combat an entire enemy squad is allowed to gang up on the IC while the rest of his unit stands around doing nothing. I don't care how good his saves are, he's not going to survive 20-25 attacks in the face.

This is one of the prime areas where I dislike the marine codex. The HQ choices are supposed to be these epic heroes, centuries-old veterans and leaders of masterful war machines that fight on a thousand fronts and have slain thousands of foes. Then in game..."Ooh looks like the Kroot's 30 attacks have made you fail three armor saves, I guess you die."

Like I said. If I could take none, I would.

[Melissia]

Occasionally 0% (yay for Celestian Retinues). Rarely much higher than 10% if I can help it.

[twomas_rox]

In my 1500pt list, i like to run Commissar Yarrick and Gunnery Sergant Harker. It is a big point sink, but i love the perks they give my units. Plus i am a big fan of Yarrick, so he is more in my list for the fun of it. He does work wonders though... him and his retinue once took out a Daemon Prince on my last turn to win the game for me on victory points..

[Schultzhoffen]

I run a 100 point bare bones Chaplain with Assault Terminators at anything under 2000Points for Codex Marines. That's it.

For my Chaos Army I have a basic DP with wings.

With My Black Templar army I have to have an EC (which is cool but he can't be the only HQ) and a Marshall with a Jump Pack (around 125pts).

Of all those the EC costs the most at 140pts.

I prefer more units than ICs. Weight of fire or attacks in CC seems to trump a single model. I prefer what the IC can do for an army or unit rather that his CC abilities (the DP is an exception).

EG, The Chaplain buffs the ATs, The EC gives Preferred Enemy, The Marshall gives army wide Ld 10.

That said, I have no issues with people who have x2 HQs (specials included). Different strokes and all that.

I suppose that somewhere deep down I feel as if Specials would only make an appearance in really large games over 2000pts but it does depend on the SC. Some DIY ICs can be tooled up tougher (A winged DP of Nurgle is hell on wheels...), but it's something that doesn't really bother me.