Deathwatch. Need some help

[gcsmith]

Heya Guys so Im wanting to enter the battle brothers tourney at my local store in february.
It requires you to buy either a battle force and commander for armies with battleforces or 4 boxes and a commander for armies without a battleforce.

Im wanting to go with deathwatch using the Grey knights rules.

Ive settled on the ordo xenos inquisitor special, but what 4 boxes Should I use. Simply asking cus (A) I want it to represent real deathwatch/ordo xenos and (B) dnt know too mcuh about them. and if competative would be a bonus.

[MaltonNecromancer]

Deathwatch are really nothing like the Grey Knights. They're basically regular Space Marines with access to more elite weapons.

You'd be better off using either the standard Space Marine codex, or the Space Wolf one.

Basic Deathwatch are essentially standard marines with better bolters, so I use them as Sternguard in my Deathwatch army - if you take Pedro Kantor, he turns them scoring, so if you field two scout squads as your minimum Troops choice, then three Sternguard squads from your Elites, you have the core of a solid Deathwatch force. I tend to make up the rest of the army from jump pack Vanguard, as well as Honour Guard - basically, nothing that's not elite; no standard Tacticals, no standard Assault, etc...

If I was using the GK codex, I think I'd use Terminators as my core Troop choice, then have the rest of the army made up of Honour Guard-style squads (to count as Purifiers) and some choice Heavy Bolter teams (to count as Purgation Squads). You could use Interceptors too quite easily - the Deathwatch certainly have access to esoteric equipment far more readily than their peers.

If I was buying boxes of models, I'd honestly buy a couple of standard tactical squads, and the Deathwatch conversion kits from GW (if you don't like converting), or else a whole bunch of Scout Bolt Pistols and Terminator Storm Bolters (to convert the boltguns).

Here's some of my Deathwatch to give you an idea of what I did:

http://www.lounge.belloflostsouls.net/showthread.php?t=16716

Realistically, the Deathwatch are a very expensive (in money) army to field, purely because you have to buy a huge number of highly expensive conversion bits.

[gcsmith]

One thing there is no FOC or points limits its use wats ever you get in battalion or the 4 boxes if your army doesnt have a battalion

[MaltonNecromancer]

I'd go for a standard Marine Battalion then. It's got almost everything you need to run a Deathwatch force. If you do the four boxes of Grey Knights, I'd just do four boxes of Terminators. I honestly don't think the Grey Knights and Deathwatch are comparable in any sense, beyond the fact they both wear power armour. Their weapons, tactics, and abilities are totally different. You could do Deathwatch as Marines, Blood Angels, Space Wolves, Black Templars, or Dark Angels, but they just don't really work as Grey Knights.

[Rev. Tiberius Jackhammer]

Deathwatch is really a poor match for Grey Knights - Deathwatch fight with Bolters with Special Ammo and have few psykers. Grey Knights fight with Storm Bolters and Force Weapons and are all psykers. Space Marines with Pedro Kantor are the probably best fit for Deathwatch. If you're looking for a reason to do a Grey Knights counts-as, maybe do the Blood Ravens' first company? Fluffwise, they have several all-psyker squads and probably Librarian dreads, so they'd be a good fit.

[gcsmith]

Well The idea would be an ordo xenos army with deathwatch so Gk is best fit so I can get inquisitors as well. and the powers could be just advanced tech that the AH have access to.

[Dooley]

I think you are Grasping at straws here. Grey Knights are NOT Death Watch! If you want a Death watch army Go with the Space Marine Battle Force Box and a Librarian as a HQ choice. The original Death Watch (at least the first one I can remember had a Squad of Death Watch being lead by a Death Watch Librarian!) If you want the "Inquisitor Feel" Take an Iquisitor model and Use the Rules for a SM Libraian in Power Armor.

Also I dont think one would ever really see a DEATH WATCH ARMY! Death watch is more of an Elite Strike force. Maybe a Squad or two sent in to kill a Brood Lord/Hive Tyrant/ Warlock/Farseer/Etherial/Warboss but not an ENTIRE ARMY! Remember Death Watch is a special DUTY ASSIGNMENT for Space Marines not its own chapter. The Death Watch is made up of Space Maines from Various Chapters that server for a few Years and then are sent BACK to their parant chapter to pass on the skills they have learned in Xenos Purging to the Chapter.

[Dalleron]

You'd actually see a deathwatch army about as often as you'd see a GK army. Only, you'd probably not survive seeing a GK army if you are/were an Imperial peon.

Ruleswise a sternguard army does work better with vanilla marines as opposed to the grey ones. But in theory a GK based Deathwatch army could work. It doesn't make much sense to me that a Storm Bolter is assault while a regular bolter isn't, since a storm bolter amounts to 2 bolters shooting at once. But that's another debate. Using GK as deathwatch, you've just got special weapons for use as Deathwatch. The pyscher stuff is harder to explain I will admit. You would have to get creative in explaining that one.

[thecactusman17]

It's not that Grey Knights have the wrong weapons, it's that the defining trait has always been the fact that Deathwatch are all recruited from standard Marine chapters, something much harder to represent with Grey Knights. Deathwatch are standard Marines given new training, specialized ammo, but few if any new weapons. Standard Space Marines with Sternguard, Scoutes (which handily fill in for some of the more outsider-unfriendly chapters like Dark Angels who nominate such recruits to get them additional training without exposing chapter secrets), drop pod assaults and lots of poisoned shooting will represent an Ordo Xenos force handily. Again, give them a "Librarian in power armor" from the Inquisitor lineup and they function fine.

If you want Grey Knights codex, the only thing you can really do is henchmen. Grey Knights will be a really poor representation of Deathwatch Marines.

[gcsmith]

one of the abilities of the GK codex is henchman along side marines, and too me, the sternguard miss a key thing from the DW, moveable heavy bolter.

Pyschic powers could be explained as experimental wargear that can only be used in limited bursts

[Schlitzaf]

As others have iterated earlier GK are not a good Deathwatch army, and I think they are correct in saying Codex: Space Marines are.

First off, while I agree with you on how having Ordos Xenos Inquistor in a Deathwatch army makes sense, more often than not Inquistors will on be frontline. They are planers, and negiotiators and not warriors by nature.

You go on to say the Sterngaurd lack movable heavy bolter, is a pscyannon at all comparable? I would think no.

The scouts while not perfect could represent Inquistorial Henchmen or drafted Gaurdsmen, their WS/BS match that critia perfectly if not their strength/toughness. Telion could be an Inquistor, Master of the Forged with conversion Beamer as well. Yes they are not perfect subsistutes but Codex: Deathwatch does not exist. So nothing is perfect

Also saying that physic powers could just be very advanced technology, it could be argued but it forms a big plot hole. That Physic Hoods can stop them, Shadows in the Warp etc, also the max force a Deathwatch take is only 30 guys or so. That is only in response to somthing like a Wraaagh. The Grey Knight army, could easily have double that if it is anything like other GK armies I've seen. Also Grey Knights when they deploy, deploy in force. They are actually fighting against said Deamon incrusion while Deathwatch are more akin to a Vindicire. If you plan on taking a more then 2 squads of Henchmen, your taking Coteaz in addition to your Xenos Inquistor. Which will make said things more inline but still falls short the playstyle is different.

The Grey Knights are mid-range army, with things like Dreadnoughts and Land Raiders as support, and with Henchmen you have Deathcult Assassins in Land Raiders or some kind of vehicles. Then again I could be making massive assumptions, but in contrast Deathwatch or more of teleport in, teleport out. Functioning as close-range army in move in 12' marker and rapid fire. They don't have massive machines of war like Land Raider. They might have 1-2 Dreadnoughts but they are close support ones with multi-meltas, and assault cannons. The Deathwatch themselves when not teleporting in, try to mow down enemies when they come in. The Grey Knights can easily move up and hold because of there assault 2 weapons and psycannons.

The best two examples I can think of, is when Kryptman sent a squad(s) of Deathwatch to reclaim the Tyranid Sample from Behemoth. It was percise, and pinpointed, while if you take oppesite coin and take a Mallues Inquistor requesting help against Deamons. An example could be one were Mordrak lost his Brotherhood, a whole Brotherhood was sent in.

p.s pardon spelling/grammer, if I sound confrontional I didn't mean to and any fluff mistakes

[Coyote81]

I completely disagree I think Gk fit perfectly and have been playing a Deathwatch army since the GK book came out. It's truely a Xenos Inquisition army, but Deathwatch are an intergral portion of the army. I do agree that the army really wouldn't employ more then 30 Deathwatch space marines and I do infact limit the vechiles to rhinos, razorbacks, and 2 dreadnoughts as the deathwatch portion of the army. However the rest of the equipment and units can easily be explained bt the employment of the Xenos Inquisitor (AkA Coteaz stand in). My army currently consists of:
GK Librarian (DeathWatch Force Commander) -Deathwatch employ librarians in the forces as well. (One day to be replaced with Hector Rex)
Coteaz (Xenos Inquisitor)
5 man purifier squad (Dea****ch unit A)w/ Rhino
Vindicare assassin (Inquisitor requisition)
Techmarine ( Deathwatch Captain)
1x 10man Strike squad (Always combat squads. Deathwatch unit B and C)w/ Razorback Las/plas
1x 5man Strike squad (Deathwatch unit D) w/Razorback Las/plas
2x 6man Henchman squad 3x melta 3x bolter (Inquisitional Storm Troopers) w/Razorback Hvy Bolters
1x 12man DCA/Crusader squad (Inquisitor Retinue)
1x Interceptor Squad (Deathwatch unit E, Using Raptor Jumppacks to represent sup'd up Jumppacks)
!x Inquisitorial Landraider (Lib and Retinue go in here)
2x Dreadnoughts tl A/Cs

All of my Psycannons are modelled as assault cannons (making it a very unique looking army. No other army has marines the more and shoot assault cannons.) Easy conversion using heavy bolters and assault cannons. I modelled all my models using blood angel sanguine guard wrist bolters for storm bolters, making them look very different from Gk armies. The only Gk parts I've used in the army really are some halberds and incinerators.

[AdamHarry]

Heya Guys so Im wanting to enter the battle brothers tourney at my local store in february.
It requires you to buy either a battle force and commander for armies with battleforces or 4 boxes and a commander for armies without a battleforce.

Im wanting to go with deathwatch using the Grey knights rules.

Ive settled on the ordo xenos inquisitor special, but what 4 boxes Should I use. Simply asking cus (A) I want it to represent real deathwatch/ordo xenos and (B) dnt know too mcuh about them. and if competative would be a bonus.

So back to your orginal question which boxes you should buy:

2 terminator boxes
2 grey knight boxes
Draigo

You're running a Deathwatch, Counts-as GK army. Just to be clear, you need to use the GK rules and make-up what ever fluff reason you're using Deathwatch and it would work.

Draigo with Palidins and Purifiers would be pretty mean especially if you're limited to 4 boxes and a commander.

[thecactusman17]

So back to your orginal question which boxes you should buy:

2 terminator boxes
2 grey knight boxes
Draigo

You're running a Deathwatch, Counts-as GK army. Just to be clear, you need to use the GK rules and make-up what ever fluff reason you're using Deathwatch and it would work.

Draigo with Palidins and Purifiers would be pretty mean especially if you're limited to 4 boxes and a commander.

http://twilight.ponychan.net/chan/fic/src/131743714936.jpg

[gcsmith]

cheers for the advice guys but probs wont take part in tourney due to splugring on new laptop :P cant afford new army yet, waiting till templars/tau/brets redone

[Xenith]

Nevermind