Resurrection orb

[Baka]

If the Lord carrying it what kind of save is it? Would it be considered an invulnerable save? Yes the second question is an assassin using a shield breaker shot able to take it away as wargear?

[mstingray]

No as its not an invulnerable save, it is their re-animation protocols roll.

[Brosef Stalin]

No as its not an invulnerable save, it is their re-animation protocols roll.

This. The Assassin wouldn't be able to keep the rolls from being made.

[AbusePuppy]

Reanimation Protocols and Everliving, like Feel No Pain, are not saves. They are additional special rules that grant you a measure of survivability, but that doesn't make them saves. A Vindicare can shoot off the 3++ granted by a Phase Shifter (on a Lord or on a Wraith), but cannot deny them RP/EL rolls. It's worth pointing out that C'tan can now have their invulnerable save shot off by a Vindi now as well (which, incidentally, will also stop them from exploding somehow.)

[dannyat2460]

Reanimation Protocols and Everliving, like Feel No Pain, are not saves. They are additional special rules that grant you a measure of survivability, but that doesn't make them saves. A Vindicare can shoot off the 3++ granted by a Phase Shifter (on a Lord or on a Wraith), but cannot deny them RP/EL rolls. It's worth pointing out that C'tan can now have their invulnerable save shot off by a Vindi now as well (which, incidentally, will also stop them from exploding somehow.)

No they will still explode as all the shield breaker does is take away the invun granted by wargear it doesnt say it destroys that wargear as such it will still get the other rules granted by it,

Terminator armour is the best example just because you have taken off the 5++ does not mean the model loses the 2+ or the relentless or the unable to do a sweeping advance

[Wildcard]

Terminator armour is the best example just because you have taken off the 5++ does not mean the model loses the 2+ or the relentless or the unable to do a sweeping advance

It is not terminator armor itself that grants the 5+invu, its a crux terminatus "personal force field generator" inbuilt in terminator armor that grants the invu save.

"The ceramite plates can deflect most conventional assaults, whilst the Crux Terminatus on every terminators shoulder plate serves as a ward capable of turning aside even the attacks from a power weapons or melta fire" - From terminator armor description, pg 63 GK dex.

Anyway, question about resurrection orb in a following case (happened last game we had):

A squad of immortals, necron overlord and a cryptec (from the court) was banded together. while it took many turns of shooting to get the immortals to stay down, in the end, only overlord (who at this point had 1 wound left) and cryptec was alive.

How would you rule this: Both the Overlord and Cryptec were shot down on the following shooting phase so that no models were on the table (only two everliving tokens). Question: Does the orb affect them so that they both get to try reanim protocols with 4+, or because the orb was not on the table at the time of the roll, reanim only works on 5+?

I dont own a necron dex, so i can't read the exact wording.

[Luke Licens]

Ever Living models that have joined a unit cannot stand back up if the unit has been completely wiped out.


If the model had joined a unit when it was removed as a casualty, and the roll was passed, it must be returned to play, with a single wound, in coherency with that unit as explained in Reanimation Protocols.
...

If the returning model cannot be placed, for whatever reason, it is lost and does not return.

The IC Overlord has joined the (now single model) unit of the Cryptek, neither can be placed in coherency with the wiped out unit, both evaporate.

Edit to add:
Now, if the Overlord were by himself on the table, either by leaving the unit, or by having it wiped out in a previous turn, leaving him the last modes standing, he could then use Ever Living to stand back up.

As the rules stand, Ever Living serves no purpose on Lords and Crypteks, either in Courts or as Upgrade Characters, as they will always be wiped out with the rest of their unit, never able to stand back up without at least one other model still standing.

[AbusePuppy]

No they will still explode as all the shield breaker does is take away the invun granted by wargear it doesnt say it destroys that wargear as such it will still get the other rules granted by it,

Terminator armour is the best example just because you have taken off the 5++ does not mean the model loses the 2+ or the relentless or the unable to do a sweeping advance

Huh, right you are; could've sworn it broke the whole item, it's sorta the other way around, as it just kills all invulns on the model.


As the rules stand, Ever Living serves no purpose on Lords and Crypteks, either in Courts or as Upgrade Characters, as they will always be wiped out with the rest of their unit, never able to stand back up without at least one other model still standing.
And this doesn't lead you to believe that maybe that interpretation of the rule, even though it might follow the wording more strictly, is still wrong?

[Luke Licens]

I said 'as the rules stand'. I'd love for that bit to be errata-ed away, but until it is Ever-Living models in units die like the dogs they slog with.

I do wonder if giving Ever Living to Lords and Crypteks might have something to do with previous iterations of Reanimation Protocols/We'll Be Back. In particular, the previous codex restriction that there had to be an identical model still on the table to let them stand back up. EL would allow uniquely equipped Lords/Crypteks to stand back up even in the face of that restriction, and could remain as a vestigial rule even after that restriction was removed.

But that's all purely hypothetical. I do hope that the original intention and eventual outcome is that my shiny special robot zombie gets to keep coming back from the dead again and again. :D

[Wildeybeast]

It is not terminator armor itself that grants the 5+invu, its a crux terminatus "personal force field generator" inbuilt in terminator armor that grants the invu save.

"The ceramite plates can deflect most conventional assaults, whilst the Crux Terminatus on every terminators shoulder plate serves as a ward capable of turning aside even the attacks from a power weapons or melta fire" - From terminator armor description, pg 63 GK dex.

Of course, if we are being picky, that is just fluff and irrelevant in the rules, the crux terminatus is part and parcel of the armour as far as the rules are concerned and not a seperate piece of wargear, so danny's termie armour example is quite valid from that point of view.

[Baka]

Ever Living models that have joined a unit cannot stand back up if the unit has been completely wiped out.



The IC Overlord has joined the (now single model) unit of the Cryptek, neither can be placed in coherency with the wiped out unit, both evaporate.

Edit to add:
Now, if the Overlord were by himself on the table, either by leaving the unit, or by having it wiped out in a previous turn, leaving him the last modes standing, he could then use Ever Living to stand back up.

As the rules stand, Ever Living serves no purpose on Lords and Crypteks, either in Courts or as Upgrade Characters, as they will always be wiped out with the rest of their unit, never able to stand back up without at least one other model still standing.

That is ultimately where my question was going. That explains it better than I could have even imagined, Thanks.