Apoc 2nd edition

[Advachiel]

Wanted to start a thread about this unless one had already existed, not sure.

Wanted to see peoples thoughts on the new updated rules in Apoc 2nd ed, specifically if they felt certain models are now better or more specifically worse than before.

My first thought, poor An' garath and rage, that one makes me sad..

[DrLove42]

Angrath did get hurt a bit. Having rage, even with his vastly increased move hurts him

But the other 2 demons got boosts i think. Sure Slanesh no longer ignore Invuln saves, but seems better now. Nurgle....well a Hellstorm template flamer is wrong. Add in to a Nurlge list with Epidemus and you could have superpowered people everywhere in one shot.

[Archon]

I think the rage rule is no great nerf to the big bloody guy cause it is not easy in a apoc game to give him something cheep to play. There is little till nothing that the bloodiest thirster can´t destroy.

But for the loveley big deamonette (and the big ugly fat blob) their psipowers are gone. Instead they had some shooting attacks... okay the rerolls and the i-save for the slaaneshi fem KoS are good. Like it/her/him/whatever:cool:

[Advachiel]

Any thoughts on the changes to the necron tomb stalker? I like being able to charge what I can't see as opposed to the shooting in the dark.. I can say that much

[Advachiel]

Thoughts on synergy of the tombstalker with new ctan shards or tomb wraiths? Im running a canoptek list i think.

[Defenestratus]

I've played a couple of games with the warp hunters and Wraithseer out of the Eldar section.

I have to say that the wraithseer is balanced IMO. He's expensive, he's relatively tough to kill and his powers are nothing special. In my experience, giving FNP to wraithguard/lords is stupid since only AP2,1 stuff is used to shoot him. Fleet on wraithlords is of medium utility since they don't have enough attacks to really make the WL a huge threat in close combat.
The wraithseer's d-cannon is for sure its best aspect.

On the other hand - the warp hunters are, IMO broken.

Large template D-cannon is simply devastating at 36" range. Sure its not as great as a FP at anti-tank, however the fact that the weapon maintains its effectiveness even if the hole center scatters off the target makes it just as good IMO.

Furthermore, the fact that its on a fast skimmer tank that can move 12", with the range of 36" means that with a 48" effective range that does not require LOS.... brutal. Add to the fact that its AP2 Barrage that always wounds on 2's makes the whole thing just feel a little, "busted".

Two of them with a guiding farseer sitting behind a huge building literally reduced my opponent's grey knights to piles of ethergoop in a matter of a few rounds.

[Regnir]

I'm still at a loss for an opinion either way on the changes to Scabiethrax.

On the one hand, having a decent punching hellstorm is nice, and having both defensive and assault grenades is kind of neat too, and the "every model except daemons or MoN models within 6" take a wound with no saves on failed toughness test" is cute.

However, the loss of four wounds, the loss of 6" of movement, and the addition of a rule which I feel pretty much does nothing for a Gargantuan Creature(Feel No Pain) kind of feels like burning.

I'll have to break him out in a game or two to know for certain, but I'm kind of unsure about it right now.

[DrLove42]

FNP on Scabi does seem a bit wierd, seeing as the only things that can really wound him at ap1 or 2.

It can be taken against poison shots (which all wound on 6's) and missiles (as long as they're AP3)

As for the eldar being a touch broken...don't complain. its nice to have a unit thats actually useful

[Battle Ready Studios]

If I'm not mistaken, Meotic Spores used to effect aircraft, and now they dont... rendering Tyranids completely unable to deal with aircraft.

[L192837465]

If I'm not mistaken, Meotic Spores used to effect aircraft, and now they dont... rendering Tyranids completely unable to deal with aircraft.

Can't Gargoyles attack flyers?

[Denzark]

I like this book. But i am vexed by the editing, particularly with regard to the units that can be used in 40K. Some of them have their FOC slot details underneath the actual picture of the unit. Some have them in the rules boxout. Some don't appear to have where they fit at all!

I can see some things which may add new dynamic - particularly the Lucius drop pod (Bjorn in a pod anyone?) and also the Caestus ram with its 10 terminators and moving 36". Also the Land Raider Monolith - I mean Achilles.

Not sure if these things are broken for 40K vanilla but would require hard work by an opponent.

[andrewm9]

Can't Gargoyles attack flyers?

Flyers cannot be assaulted in any way. Flyers have other defenses like only be able to be hit by ranged weapons 6's with AA mounts and a reduction in range of all non AA mounted weapons by 12". They also have a cover save of 4+ against all non AA guns.

[Battle Ready Studios]

Really looking forward to the Dominus Bombard

[Defenestratus]

Flyers cannot be assaulted in any way. Flyers have other defenses like only be able to be hit by ranged weapons 6's with AA mounts and a reduction in range of all non AA mounted weapons by 12". They also have a cover save of 4+ against all non AA guns.

Not true.

Baharroth's Swooping hawk formation can attack fliers with their haywire grenades.

[andrewm9]

Not true.

Baharroth's Swooping hawk formation can attack fliers with their haywire grenades.

OK barring something wackly like a very special formation rule it is. I guess I missed that little tidbit though I wouldn't really call it an assault.

[JMichael]

Just ordered my copy yesterday and it shipped today! btw ordering FW books from GW.com (at least in the US) is cheaper and much much faster than from forgeworld.

[JMichael]

Arggg, the book is sitting at the Post Office and won't be delivered till tomorrow...oh, the agony!