Should I take up WFB???

[Denzark]

Right, herewith.

As a fairly mobile individual moving around I have encountered several gaming groups. Recently I have avoided the clarion call to take on board extra game systems, based on then fact of: a.) The enjoyment I get from 40K (warts and all - I have been playing for 21+ years) and b.) I have so much unpainted stuff in my stores it would be a waste of time.

The first group I joint allowed me to play WM 1.0, the second Mechwarrior.


But I am massively tempted by WFB (as I have a good base of fantasy minis painted from Advanced Heroquest etc.

So - the question to the floor - should I consider starting WFB - what are the major problems a seasoned 40K player would discover with 8th ed, and what armies should be considered (by a Chaos player) and why?

[Mr.Pickelz]

It all depends on what play style you like. As Fantasy does plays differently than 40k does. Also, with certain armies you could be looking at 10 to 20 times more models then you currently have. Fantasy will take a little time to get use to, because of the modifiers and slight change in phases, etc. I'd suggest you pick up the mini rule book or BRB(which ever one is cheaper) and start reading up on the rules before deciding on diving in. And then from there, go pick the army that fits/reflects your style.

[Multigeneral]

Do you have a strong fantasy group in your area? If so, pop in and watch them play after you've aquired said rulebook. Maybe they'll be nice enough to let you "try out" an army. Don't limit yourself to chaos though. You may enjoy the playstyle of one of the other armies more. :eek: As for fules differences theres a bunch, but if you've never played Fantasy before you'll pick them up quick. Or at least you won't have 4 editions worth rattling around in your head.

[Psychosplodge]

No, by the time you have a painted army two editions will have been released...

[eldargal]

Psychosploge does touch one one of the problems 40k players often have when they try WFB, namely the number of figures. You paint ten figures in 40k and you have a squad, except for Orks and Tyranids perhaps. Painting ten figures for WFB means you have 25% or a third of a regiment maybe, except for Ogres. Of course it wasn't always like this, in 7th you coudl have armies with fewer figures than a 40k army at the same points level, it was messed up. The game is Warhammer Fantasy Battles, after all.

Anyway, I'd see if you can play with a demo army or some such, even go to a GW store if you need too. That way you can see if you enjoy it without wasting money on figures and rulebooks.

[Wildeybeast]

I think one of the biggest things to get used to is the extra layer of tatical depth. 40k is basically a case of picking the biggest, killiest, toughest, meanest units you can, dumping them on the table and then shoving them towards each other. Fantasy is much more about picking balanced armies that complement each other, deathstar units can't win you the game on your own. Deployment and movement are vital as if you mess those up it will cost you big. And they take a bit of getting used to due to having ranked up units rather than skirmishing squads. And of course magic and psychology add an extra level. But these are all good things, that bring an extra level of challenge and thus enjoyment. The base mechanics of the game are the same, so you won't find it hard to get to grips with the differences. I say go for it, but as others have said, try to get some trial games in with various armies to find the one that suits you.

[Thornblood]

Fantasy is a game won in the movement phase.

40k is a game won, largely, in the prep.

Whilst you can glean plenty from previous experience in fantasy, and make plenty of winning combos on your roster sheet, and have plenty of planned tactics, quite frankly fantasy is won in the movement phase as the game happens.

However, before you do throw your lot in, Warmachine/Hordes plays differently as well. For me, coming from a GW jack-of-all-trades plus Rackham and other very similar games it blew my mind. Literally, if your playing Warmachine/hordes well, there is so much synergy happening between units (normally in the form of buffs) that it did stretch my mind and I had to do some serious thinking (also being new to a game predicting possibilities is alot harder).

Finally, I would like to recommend one of my favorite games; Mordheim. Not bad as a halfway house between 40k and fantasy, if you have a fair few but not loads of painted fantasy miniatures you can pick up and play with most other fatansy players- no investment needed. It can give you a cash free glimpse into the fantasy gaming world, an if you like it you can get started. I do warn you, it is a skirmish game and many of the warbands do not reflect the play style of their larger armies (i.e. the chaos list is for cultists, not northern barbarians, skaven work best in massed ranks in fantasy and yet they become an army of assasins etc etc- still fits with the fluff but different play).

[Xas]

I think one of the biggest things to get used to is the extra layer of tatical depth. 40k is basically a case of picking the biggest, killiest, toughest, meanest units you can, dumping them on the table and then shoving them towards each other. Fantasy is much more about picking balanced armies that complement each other, deathstar units can't win you the game on your own. Deployment and movement are vital as if you mess those up it will cost you big. And they take a bit of getting used to due to having ranked up units rather than skirmishing squads. And of course magic and psychology add an extra level. But these are all good things, that bring an extra level of challenge and thus enjoyment. The base mechanics of the game are the same, so you won't find it hard to get to grips with the differences. I say go for it, but as others have said, try to get some trial games in with various armies to find the one that suits you.

and there we have one who obviously is more a fantasy player and less a 40k genius ;)

to destile the truth out of that words: fantasy is more obvious about how important the movement phase is for your game. while the 360° fire and charge angles of infantry lure you into thinking tactical movement isn't crucial in 40k the rules in WHFB are straight forward enough to let everyone understand those facts (units can only charge/shoot foward arc).

in addition to that your charackters are both more numberous and more important to the army than in 40k. were 40k has only a limited number of named charackters that really affect your army other than killing the enemy EVERY army in WHFB has a general who generates a LDS bubble around him simply by beeing chose to do so. the way combat works also means that charackters are more powerfull in melee (stackable armor and invul saves help further) and the lack of instant death from readily available double strenght means it can be quite hard for even an elite unit to deal with a hero/lord on their own (if he has a retinue that is on par with the unit they are attackin its allmost certainly over!)

[DarkLink]

I too call bull on the idea that 40k just consists of taking deathstars and throwing at each other. Especially compared to how Fantasy plays, though I don't know how much better 8th ed is about that since I don't play Fantasy.

Tactics are much, much more subtle in 40k. It's not a matter of 'ok, I've deployed and now my units can only move in one direction so I hope I deployed well'. It's a matter of fluidly maneuvering into just the right place at just the right time with just the right amount of force. Just because you can move and see 360 degrees doesn't somehow make movement less important.

[Drunkencorgimaster]

You know, considering how similar these two games could be, it is remarkable how different they are. Get ready for significantly more rules, but ones that are generally consistent. The game is a lot less forgiving of mistakes and takes longer to get a handle on. It is really fun though in the end, and the painting opportunities are first rate.

[Lord Azaghul]

I too call bull on the idea that 40k just consists of taking deathstars and throwing at each other. Especially compared to how Fantasy plays, though I don't know how much better 8th ed is about that since I don't play Fantasy.

Tactics are much, much more subtle in 40k. It's not a matter of 'ok, I've deployed and now my units can only move in one direction so I hope I deployed well'. It's a matter of fluidly maneuvering into just the right place at just the right time with just the right amount of force. Just because you can move and see 360 degrees doesn't somehow make movement less important.

For added clarificatino
The wfb the game is often won or lost in deploment
The game has added huge deathstars AND magic IS key to the game.

[eldargal]

Sort of. Deathstars came in in 7th, 8th has reduced their effectiveness in numerous ways, some of the spells for example. Deathstars are now much more vulnerable than they were in 7th, which is only a good thing. Magic is powerful, but it is also fickle and so long as you take some anti-magic you can get away with being mageless atleast in some armies (Empire with Warrior Priests, for example).

It is true deploying poorly can lose you the game, but the same can be said of 40k for many armies.

Both systems have equal depth, they just focus on different aspects in different ways. Personally I think 8th is in the best place it has been since 5th edition or even 4th, a good time to pick it up.

[Old_Paladin]

I'd say go for it.

Start small. A fighty hero, a mage hero, a block of infantry or two, maybe some cavalry and a war machine.
It's lets you get used to all the new rules, and see what each kind of unit is and isn't capable of doing.

[doom-kitten]

Honestly people can spit out the advice and lay down mountains of opinions the only way you'll really ever know is to give it a shot, maybe you'll like it maybe you won't. For me Fantasy died alittle and I'm now pretty focused on 40K.LIke you've read before the key phase is movement and the deployment as the proper placement can do wonders for victory, the premeasuring makes it to easy for a skilled player to control the game however. Anyways like I said mountains of opinions but only one way to be sure, try it.

[Duke]

Moved to the Warhammer Fantasy forum... Go figure!

[Denzark]

Mr Duke

I thought where to put this. I wanted advice from WFB playing 40K players, not just from WFB players...

[Wildeybeast]

To be fair, the majority of people who post in the fantasy forums are also regulars in the 40k forum, so you shouldn't have too much trouble. As doomkitten as said, you need to gve it a go. I like both but I am baised towards fantasy (as you may noticed!) and there are plenty of people who like both, but they are different enough that you may like one and not the other, so as doomkitten says you won't know until you try. One observation I will offer based on my experience of gaming in my area (and I'm not syainghtis applies everywhere), is that fantasy attracts a different type of player. They are almost exclusively adults, I see very few kids playing it. Also fantasy players tend to be less competitive and more about having a fun and relaxed game, I think partly because the rules have been around for longer, they have more experience at balancing the armies and its less about the new army 'arms race' you get in 40k.