players dropping from tournaments????

[volrath8754]

Hey guys I want to know how all of your FLGS deal with players dropping from tournaments?

What do you do to prevent it, and what score do you give their opponent when they drop half way threw a game? It is becoming a problem at my FLGS, and we are all banging our heads against the wall a massacre seems to generous but a minor victory or tie seems to harsh.

WTF to do? Any thoughts are welcome.

[isotope99]

No practical experience but the greater of a minor victory and their average fron the other games they play seems reasonable. So if they massacred everyone else, full points.

[Dont-Be-Haten]

My First question would be, how often to you have tourneys, what are your point systems and items etc. next would be what's the price tag on entering, thirdly how many consistent players do you have, and of those how many drop? If you are playing in a solid meta, you should explain before hand that the tournament is not for casual players, and that if you ragequit for being tabled, or just ragequit in general you are suspended from trounament play for the next week (or next tournament outside of premeire events or prelimianries for the 'ard boyz) Dropping because they have absolutely no chance of topping is a completely different ball game. If they have played 3-4 rounds and are -3 in win/loss ratio dropping shouldn't be viewed as so terrible and you could either give the other player (unless you don't play swiss) a massacre/minor victory depending points and if the opponent has deployed or not. It has always been my understanding that if the opponent concedes a match, they lose straight up; but I'm not familair with 40k or any Table Top point systems, I really only know card games and since I'm a Judge at my locals for said card games then I usually rule it that way. In most cases I explain to new players that the people that play in my tourneys are extremely competitive and unless they can handle going up against tier 1 players and decks then they should hold off and just play casually. I also tell them that if they have to be somewhere before the tournament ends then they should skip out on this one, etc. Because each round lasts 40 minutes (much less than the 2.5 hours alotted) and there's usually 4-5 rounds. It happens every time and kids get really upset about it but that's part of the risk of playing in tourneys. I would simply suggest that if kids (I use this term loosely as for slang such as a universal you) that want to play seriously need to do their homework, and that there are repercussions if they consistantly enter and then drop. That's about the best advice I can give, from playing a game completely different.

Lastly I would also suggest incentives to stick around somehow. With asking if you can use them for random battle reports on youtube, or some other random cool deal that gives them the thought that they aren't just scrubbies or something else along those lines. But most importantly make them feel at home and make sure they have fun. I hope this all helped a little (even though I know almost nothing of the game, that's just how I would approach the situation.)

[Orminah]

Honestly, I think it's stupid to penalize someone to drop from a game because they're being crushed. If someone has had 90% of their force beaten to a bloody pulp, and their opponent has only taken about 10% causalities, yeah, I can see why anyone would want to throw the game, especially if it's particularly upsetting.

I think the best thing to do, from an organizer's standpoint, is to count it as a major victory for the person that won, and move on. And, of course, time permitting, make sure he didn't throw the game, and then possibly award a massacre.

[Lord Azaghul]

Always award the guy who didn't disrespect his opponent half way through the tournament by quitting with a massacre.

Odds are the game was going that way already.

[plasticaddict]

First off we charge a fee to enter any event (except ard boyz) $5 for a tournament $10-15 for a league, that has the effect of limiting the player pool to those that are serious about playing. The entry fees go into prize support for the event.

Second if you quit the game while playing it's an auto massacre to your opponent for that game and a zero points for you.

If you drop out of the event: You do not get a refund and you are banned from the next 2 events for that system. (exceptions are made for emergencies) These rules also apply if someone is caught cheating although the ban becomes a little longer.

These rules appear to work pretty well, we were having a problem with some people dropping out when it didn't look like they could place anymore. Since we started doing things this way we lost some players but surprisingly whit them gone we also stopped having any noticeable problems.

[Orminah]

I see you're from San Antonio, plastic, this isn't at Dragon's Lair, is it?

[Dont-Be-Haten]

Yeah that sounds about right. That happens a lot with my tournaments as well. But in those cases the players that I have placed against each other late tournmanet usually don't have a chance to win anyways. Usually you have an idea of who's going to top by mid to mid/late tournament (round 3-4). Here's my suggestion.

If they have no chance of topping let them drop. It's really just a waste of everyone's time if they have been tabled/destroyed previously and have no chance at a prize. The points skew will not make a big difference. If it was with a player who just misses the cusp of topping I'd give them the points and have a finals round for 1-3. (that's usually what I do depending on people that join, and their win/loss ratio, sometimes I extend all the way out to 5th place because of all the people that enter). The only time any money should be refunded is if they have to drop before the tournament starts i.e. there's an emergency or they just change their mind (usually 5-10 minutes before you have the round one matches set up.)

It sounds like you have a solid answer to your problem. You're definitely going about it the right way, I would just go back to the incentives of trying to be extra friendly to make the players feel at home, I would also look to trying to get some folks to make battle reports for the lower tier players (such as written to be posted on websites or video reports on YouTube or other podcasts in order for them to stick around). Some players really like being in the lime light and getting onto someone's web stream. The only other thing I could think of is extend out prizes to one further place (depending on your group) or let them get something like a coke for $1. Hope this helps or gives you extra ideas to help solve your problem.
-DBH

[SotonShades]

most of the tournaments I've gone to give you points for losing, even if it is just a token amount, and no points for dropping out mid game. However, judges generally award a loss point if the person drops because they had no possible way of winning or drawing.

Otherwise, paying ahead of time to be able to enter generally ensures people turn up and play, so you usually have a pretty good idea of numbers, rather than expecting 30 to turn up because they have signed up, and only getting 5

[Soups]

Always award the guy who didn't disrespect his opponent half way through the tournament by quitting with a massacre.

Odds are the game was going that way already.

Sometimes things pop up. had a guy who left first round because his wife got in a car accident. The dumbest thing to happen was a guy left in round 3 to watch a pre-season football game.

The best idea I can think of is assessing what the round looks like before both guys pack up for the round.

On the way to a massacre? Massacre.

Did the guy leaving have a way to not be tabled/massacred? Major victory.

If it looks pretty dismal because one player is getting rolled. Force the players to round 5, and call it from there. It might seem mean spirited to force guys to play a called game, but it cleans any stench of "throwing" the game from the sour grapes sure to pop-up. who knows, maybe forcing someone to play to turn 5 might make people realize it is not as bad as it could be.

[gcsmith]

this is an interesting topic. since Ive only just been to 2 tournies. 1 with prize support. I aint seen this happen. And even when i know I cant win I try my best to get towards the top. Afterall i play warhammer for fun so even if I cant win I still ahve an excuse to play some games :)

[addamsfamily36]

Personally, I would Ban people who drop out of games purely on a "iv'e lost already" or "i can;t be bothered" basis. If an emergency or valid reason came up then thats perfectly understandable.

I hate nothing more than people who throw or end games half way through. Even in a non tournament environment. Our local GW has a games night which can be really busy to book a table. If i turn up and my opponent quits 30-60mins into a game not only has that wasted our time but also wasted a table other people could have had a full 2 hour game on.

I actually enjoy playing when i'm the underdog/person being tabled. Sounds odd i know, but i love the challenge of clawing my way back into a draw or learning from my mistakes. I'm not an amazing player nor do i write tournament style lists, i usually lose more than i win, but i would not throw in the towel because i'm losing. I personally think it is incredibly rude to your opponent.

In a tournament situation, i think money/prize fund is a good incentive to keep people playing. If money is not involved, then its a harder situation but a "punishment" system could work. along the lines of:

- If quitting half way through a tournament game you are banned from the next tournament
- If you fail to attend a tournament, you miss 2 tournaments
- if you throw a game you automatically lose your next game regardless of outcome (maybe, this one is a bit iffy lol)

but you get my idea.

I love competitive gaming, but things like this are the reason i gave up on tournament long ago. that an unsporting behavior etc.

[Firebird]

Unless its an emergency you should not drop from an event.

[Chris Copeland]

PlasticAddict has it right: charge a fee for every tournament. That will dissuade 99% of the knuckleheads that would even consider dropping out of a tourney. Further, ban anyone who does drop out from the next couple of events. That takes care of that other 1% of the knuckleheads.

PlasticAddict is a friend of mine and he helps organize most of the tourneys I play in. We RARELY have to deal with this kind of nonsense in the San Antonio area because of the above two rules. Cheers!

[Galadren]

At my local tournament that my friend runs it usually goes like this:

$10 entry fee towards prize support.

If someone quits in the middle of a game their opponent gets max points as the player is forfeiting the game.

No one is really penalized for leaving the tournament early. They paid their fee, and if they want to quit and throw their money away then that's on them. It certainly doesn't make you popular if you quit every time you figure out you won't make it into prize support range, though.