Trouble in London

[energongoodie]

Hi guys.
I'm hoping that all the London Based BOLS members are o.k and far away from the trouble. It's spreading so fast that it's hard to tell if you are going be in the way or not.
I am 2 miles away from the fire in Croydon. Seeing a shop I know so well, and went past 2 days ago on my way to the Croydon G.W, going up in an inferno is really bringing it home. I'm feeling ill.
We need the Police to be given the authority to stop these underclass scumbags rather than running away from them. I can't believe what I am seeing.
If any BOLS members are in the thick of it then I hope you are o.k.


Just heard my town now has fires in major shops. Un-verified at the moment.

Reports of people heading into tooting.

My town is fine. The towns on either side are not.

[Morgan Darkstar]

Welcome to the 1980's

At least that's what it feels like, and i am only just old enough to remember!

Nice and calm up north tho.

[Brass Scorpion]

Welcome to the 1980's. At least that's what it feels like, and i am only just old enough to remember! Nice and calm up north tho. No, but you'd be amazed what people don't remember or don't know anything about. There's a thread about this on Dakkadakka too and I saw a post in there about how this kind of thing never happens in the US. That is one post that shows a serious lack of knowledge and also how junk, fabrications, misinformation and outright lies proliferate so easily on the Internet.

I can't believe someone posted this in earnest. Here's a link to the topic thread:
http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/list/388452.page


"You know, I wonder why we never have any Riots in the US, I hear of them all the time in the UK, but never in the USA." If only it was true.

[DarkLink]

But only ever in, like, Seattle and LA. And occasionally Berkely, where all the silver-spoon-fed liberal college students get self-righteous about something or other.

[eldargal]

Ironic for a country that is supposed to stand up to its government really.

'Our' rioters are atleast rioting due to legitimate concerns with the Metropolitan Police and various other issues. Not that at I approve what they are doing, rather hoping the police crack down rather hard now, particularly on the underclass filth that are just getting involved to loot shops and don't give a damn about the actual issue.

[Necron2.0]

There's a thread about this on Dakkadakka too and I saw a post in there about how this kind of thing never happens in the US.

Really? Someone maybe should tell that poster about a little thing called the Watts Riots:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Watts_Riots

or maybe the riots in 1992 over the arrest of Rodney King (who was guilty, by the way):

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/1992_Los_Angeles_riots

Truth be told, mostly these incidents were just an excuse for robbery, rape and murder.

Oh, I almost forgot the aftermath of Hurricane Katrina in Florida.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Civil_disturbances_and_military_action_in_New_Orle ans_after_Hurricane_Katrina

[energongoodie]

'Our' rioters are atleast rioting due to legitimate concerns with the Metropolitan Police and various other issues.

These idiots have no legitimate concerns. Any pretence to this being linked to the shooting of a gun toting drug dealer evaporated right around the time they started burning people's houses and businesses and queuing up to steal as much as there filthy criminal hands can carry.

If there is more trouble tonight then I hope the powers that be authorise a more robust response.

[DrLove42]

Agreed. The idea this being due to the shooting of a drug dealer was finished the second it went from peaceful to aggressive. Its the same idiots who turned the peaceful student protests into bloodbaths

Its disgusting. Again we live in a state where the criminal has more protection than the victim or the police.

If any police officer were to demonstrate the level of retalition required, he/she would be thrown to the dogs for "excessiveness" probably by the same people saying the police arne't doing enough

Bring in the army. Bring in Tear Gas, Water Cannons, Rubber Bullets and Curfews. Only way this is going to stop

[eldargal]

Well, there are legitimate concerns here, it is just that most of the rioters are now just doing it for lulz and lewt and because they are criminal filth, I agree. The deaths of hundreds of black suspects in police hands without any discplinary action taken is a legitimate concern, for example.

Still, agree re: army. Legitimate concerns do not justify these outrages.

[DrLove42]

I realised how to stop it. Load water cannons up with petrol and spray the rioters. See how happy they are starting fires then

[MC Tic Tac]

I realised how to stop it. Load water cannons up with petrol and spray the rioters. See how happy they are starting fires then

Live on BBC news last night a Home Office spokesman said "We own no water cannons"

Yes seriously.

[DrLove42]

**** you Cameron. **** you

Hes just been in press conference....and said nothing other than "we will punish people and have more police". No furthur action. Typical politician bull**** who can't do anything without checking it with parliment first
Every prison cell in the greater London area is now full apparantly. They're having to "export" arrested people to other counties.

I'm a little worried cos they're talking about there were attempts to organise it in my area last night. This message went around the BBM network http://http://yfrog.com/h4v7jiqj

[eldargal]

Actually they were probably sold off under the previous government, like lots of other things (like snowploughs and grit). Not that I'm excusing the current guvmint of their responsibilities, the handling of this has been disgracefully ineffectual.

I hope nothing happens where you are DrLove.

[Unzuul the Lascivious]

This needs to be controlled with EXTREME PREJUDICE. It has nothing to do with anything other than those taking part being scummy, violent, no hopers of society. I fully advocate the use of violence to quell this ridiculous scenario. It should be made clear that violence will be met with equal force and the police should not have to be afraid to use it.

I cannot believe we have no decent anti-riot gear. Ridiculous...

As for black people dying in custody - so have whites, Asians and peoples of many nationalities - don't believe statistics as they are almost always misleading.

[Aldramelech]

Agreed. The idea this being due to the shooting of a drug dealer was finished the second it went from peaceful to aggressive. Its the same idiots who turned the peaceful student protests into bloodbaths

Its disgusting. Again we live in a state where the criminal has more protection than the victim or the police.

If any police officer were to demonstrate the level of retalition required, he/she would be thrown to the dogs for "excessiveness" probably by the same people saying the police arne't doing enough

Bring in the army. Bring in Tear Gas, Water Cannons, Rubber Bullets and Curfews. Only way this is going to stop

Army? What Army? Whats left of the Army that is not somewhere hot and dusty is getting laid off next month.............................

[DrLove42]

Just look at this

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-14456050

The police can't do anything. Thye get critisiced for being too soft or too extreme, so basicvally can't do anything in that situation

The Met have just been given Plastic rounds.if they need to use them

Also this http://i55.tinypic.com/21cxauf.jpg is being passed out by people on the streets

[Aldramelech]

Do what they did in the Miners strike. Open a camp on Salisbury Plain and anyone who gets nicked gets put there until WE are ready to deal with them. Now if that takes 6 months to a year to get round to all of them, tuff!

[eldargal]

This is true actually, I did some more research and the actual figures show most of the deaths were white, but the fact remains three hundred people have died in police custody since 1998 and there has been no disciplinary action taken. There is also the fact these areas are poor with incredibly low social mobility. There are issues behind this, pretending they aren't there just means this will happen again and more often.

Having said that, it has grown far beyond these issues to a legitimat threat to publis order, safety and property so violence is needed to put the riots down. Hell when riots spread to multiple cities I'm more inclined to call it a revolt. The Chavs Revolt of 2011.


This needs to be controlled with EXTREME PREJUDICE. It has nothing to do with anything other than those taking part being scummy, violent, no hopers of society. I fully advocate the use of violence to quell this ridiculous scenario. It should be made clear that violence will be met with equal force and the police should not have to be afraid to use it.

I cannot believe we have no decent anti-riot gear. Ridiculous...

As for black people dying in custody - so have whites, Asians and peoples of many nationalities - don't believe statistics as they are almost always misleading.

[energongoodie]

A buddy just rang to say they have been asked to leave their office in Croydon.
According to the local newspapers updates there are youths gathering in Sutton.
I'm smack bang in the middle and hoping we are too small to bother with. I just hope their response is more robust tonight.

[DrLove42]

Just found out about 2 fail attempts to riot

In Southampton they tried to set fire to the Job Centre, and failed. Then went home. Good thing they failed or they'd have all been stuck next week when they came back to collect theirs

In Plymouth they tried to arrange a Riot, starting at Poundland. Fail target!

[energongoodie]

Decided to leave work a few hours early.
All the shops and restaurants I have driven past are closed and some are getting boarded up. The only thing still open is Pizza Hut. I'm hoping they tired themselves out yesterday and tonight will be quiet.

[DrLove42]

I think tonight will be quieter in London, but more widespread everywhere else

With all the extra officers in the captial it'll be quieter.

But now other places have seen it can be done outside London, i think it'll spread tonight

[Brass Scorpion]

But only ever in, like, Seattle and LA. And occasionally Berkely, where all the silver-spoon-fed liberal college students get self-righteous about something or other.That is also extremely short on facts (did you get that stuff from Glenn Beck or Bill O'Reilly?), though clearly ranks high as an effort at "trolling" and brings the level of discourse way down.

Since many of my fellow US citizens seem to have either really bad memories, a lack of interest in history, or deliberately want to distort the facts for some crazy ideology, here are a few well-documented bits of history.

First, most of the riots in the 1960's US, and there were many of them in many different cities, had to do with either ending the conflict in Vietnam or gaining equal civil rights for all US citizens. Sometimes the riots were started by the protesters, sometimes by the people trying to suppress or counter the original protest. If you're someone who thinks that either of those ideas, equal rights or ending the Vietnam conflict, were just "liberal" ideas with no merit, do us all a favor and find another topic to troll.

Second, we have had limited scale riots in cities all over this country in many different cities every year the past decade or more for things as stupid as basketball or football championships and as serious as major flaws in our justice system and perceived suppression of civil rights. Hopefully, most people think riots are not a good thing, but we have them in the US and plenty of them and in many different cities throughout the country.

A bit of humor from comedian Frank Conniff:

British Tourism Board not fooling anyone by playing Benny Hill Yakety Sax music over London riot footage.

[Aldramelech]

Just found out about 2 fail attempts to riot

In Southampton they tried to set fire to the Job Centre, and failed. Then went home. Good thing they failed or they'd have all been stuck next week when they came back to collect theirs

In Plymouth they tried to arrange a Riot, starting at Poundland. Fail target!

Used to work in a Jobcentre Plus, someones always trying to set fire to them :D

[Brass Scorpion]

An interesting article on the riots in the UK:
http://www.independent.co.uk/opinion/commentators/camila-batmanghelidjh-caring-costs-ndash-but-so-do-riots-2333991.html


Shops looted, cars and buildings burnt out, young adults in hoods on the rampage.

London has woken up to street violence, and the usual narratives have emerged – punish those responsible for the violence because they are "opportunist criminals" and "disgusting thieves". The slightly more intellectually curious might blame the trouble on poor police relations or lack of policing.

My own view is that the police in this country do an impressive job and unjustly carry the consequences of a much wider social dysfunction. Before you take a breath of sarcasm thinking "here she goes, excusing the criminals with some sob story", I want to begin by stating two things. First, violence and looting can never be justified. Second, for those of us working at street level, we're not surprised by these events.

Twitter and Facebook have kept the perverse momentum going, transmitting invitations such as: "Bare shops are gonna get smashed up. So come, get some (free stuff!!!!) F... the feds we will send them back with OUR riot! Dead the ends and colour war for now. So If you see a brother... SALUTE! If you see a fed... SHOOT!"

If this is a war, the enemy, on the face of it, are the "lawless", the defenders are the law-abiding. An absence of morality can easily be found in the rioters and looters. How, we ask, could they attack their own community with such disregard? But the young people would reply "easily", because they feel they don't actually belong to the community. Community, they would say, has nothing to offer them. Instead, for years they have experienced themselves cut adrift from civil society's legitimate structures. Society relies on collaborative behaviour; individuals are held accountable because belonging brings personal benefit. Fear or shame of being alienated keeps most of us pro-social.

Working at street level in London, over a number of years, many of us have been concerned about large groups of young adults creating their own parallel antisocial communities with different rules. The individual is responsible for their own survival because the established community is perceived to provide nothing. Acquisition of goods through violence is justified in neighbourhoods where the notion of dog eat dog pervades and the top dog survives the best. The drug economy facilitates a parallel subculture with the drug dealer producing more fiscally efficient solutions than the social care agencies who are too under-resourced to compete.

The insidious flourishing of anti-establishment attitudes is paradoxically helped by the establishment. It grows when a child is dragged by their mother to social services screaming for help and security guards remove both; or in the shiny academies which, quietly, rid themselves of the most disturbed kids. Walk into the mental hospitals and there is nothing for the patients to do except peel the wallpaper. Go to the youth centre and you will find the staff have locked themselves up in the office because disturbed young men are dominating the space with their violent dogs. Walk on the estate stairwells with your baby in a buggy manoeuvring past the condoms, the needles, into the lift where the best outcome is that you will survive the urine stench and the worst is that you will be raped. The border police arrive at the neighbour's door to grab an "over-stayer" and his kids are screaming. British children with no legal papers have mothers surviving through prostitution and still there's not enough food on the table.

It's not one occasional attack on dignity, it's a repeated humiliation, being continuously dispossessed in a society rich with possession. Young, intelligent citizens of the ghetto seek an explanation for why they are at the receiving end of bleak Britain, condemned to a darkness where their humanity is not even valued enough to be helped. Savagery is a possibility within us all. Some of us have been lucky enough not to have to call upon it for survival; others, exhausted from failure, can justify resorting to it.

Our leaders still speak about how protecting the community is vital. The trouble is, the deal has gone sour. The community has selected who is worthy of help and who is not. In this false moral economy where the poor are described as dysfunctional, the community fails. One dimension of this failure is being acted out in the riots; the lawlessness is, suddenly, there for all to see. Less visible is the perverse insidious violence delivered through legitimate societal structures. Check out the price of failing to care.

I got a call yesterday morning. The kids gave me a run-down of what had happened in Brixton. A street party had been invaded by a group of young men out to grab. A few years ago, the kids who called me would have joined in, because they had nothing to lose. One had been permanently excluded from six schools. When he first arrived at Kids Company he cared so little that he would smash his head into a pane of glass and bite his own flesh off with rage. He'd think nothing of hurting others. After intensive social care and support he walked away when the riots began because he held more value in his membership of a community that has embraced him than a community that demanded his dark side.

It costs money to care. But it also costs money to clear up riots, savagery and antisocial behaviour. I leave it to you to do the financial and moral sums.

[Bigred]

I find this image to be disturbing...

http://jalopnik.com/5828946/this-is-the-scariest-photo-from-the-london-riots

And yes, this type of thing could definately happen in the United States, people tend to forget about the LA riots... Its just easier for us Americans to brush this type of thing under the rug when it is contained to mainly poor neighborhoods.

[The Girl]

All of this reminds me of the riots in Greece back in 2008: http://www.boston.com/bigpicture/2008/12/2008_greek_riots.html

... and those haven't exactly stopped.

[wittdooley]

Man.. I'm a bit disappointed everyone is forgetting the Cincinnati Riots of 2001 (http://www.google.com/url?sa=t&source=web&cd=1&ved=0CBoQFjAA&url=http%3A%2F%2Fen.wikipedia.org%2Fwiki%2F2001_Ci ncinnati_riots&ei=9JNBTvD3JabksQLKpNXHCQ&usg=AFQjCNGnCaq9FmTnDRACvM45VdV2LSCf1Q). Give the Queen City it's credit! We riot with the best of em!

[Lord Azaghul]

These idiots have no legitimate concerns. Any pretence to this being linked to the shooting of a gun toting drug dealer evaporated right around the time they started burning people's houses and businesses and queuing up to steal as much as there filthy criminal hands can carry.

If there is more trouble tonight then I hope the powers that be authorise a more robust response.

It was the same thing over here in the 1990's (I grew up in SO. California) any excuse to throw a brick through a window and steal something.

Tell someone that they are 'oppressed' and should act out against their 'oppressors' then give them a brick...

That being said: riots do tend to take on a form of there own, and carry their own momentum, one that can't be reasoned with, and often goes beyond any pretense of social justice - the best way to deal with them is; unfortunately: force.

It should be noted that i think there is a difference between 'demonstrating/protesting' and 'rioting', and sometimes both get positive results.

[DarkLink]

That is also extremely short on facts (did you get that stuff from Glenn Beck or Bill O'Reilly?), though clearly ranks high as an effort at "trolling" and brings the level of discourse way down.


All I did was make a comment relecting the fact that we either don't get or don't see large scale riots very often. The only real riots that I had actually heard of and remembered off the top of my head were from the Seattle WTO, the LA King riots, and I happened to take a potshot at liberal college students. I didn't recall the Katrina riots, but looting after natural disasters is kinda standard practice.

Seriously, how often do I ever troll people. And that's a rhetorical question. Sure, I'll occasionally make some fun of someone for saying something really stupid, but don't go around flinging mud because you have a political agenda. Get the stick out of your ***.

[energongoodie]

Seems like all the trouble has moved North to Nottingham and Manchester. My town has had looting at the carphone warehouse and that seems to be it tonight.

As far as positive results go I am at a loss. I can't help but think that any money that could have gone to help these idiots is now going to have to go towards rebuilding what they have destroyed instead of improving what they had.

[Baron Spikey]

don't go around flinging mud because you have a political agenda. Get the stick out of your ***.
You mean like you did? Or is this a 'Do as I say, not as I do' situation?

No riots in Staffordshire or Derbyshire, sadly pockets of rioting have broken out in South Cheshire (which is a concern since I live on the border of S.Cheshire/N. staffordshire).

[Unzuul the Lascivious]

Well, all I can say is I'll be f**ked if they're doing that to my home town - I know that the men of Stowmarket will be out in force to stop any chav scum that try that round here...and I'll be first out the door with my cricket bat!

[eldargal]

Splendid idea, I like the idea of using cricket bats to maintain Engligh law and order, oddly poetic. I think I went to an agricultural museum in Stowmarket once.

[Unzuul the Lascivious]

I think the Museum of Mid Suffolk Life is probably pretty safe, but I do fear for the Wimpy...

[Faultie]

Splendid idea, I like the idea of using cricket bats to maintain Engligh law and order, oddly poetic.
Forgive my ignorance, but are you implying that this isn't common practice in England? :P

[Gotthammer]

Sales of baseball bats and batons have shot up over 5000% on Amazon.uk (http://www.reuters.com/article/2011/08/09/uk-britain-baseballbats-idUKTRE7784UF20110809).

http://i.huffpost.com/gen/325096/AMAZON-UK-BASEBALL-BAT-SALES-5000-PERCENT.jpg

[Drew da Destroya]

I'm not sure if that's funny or disturbing. Do they really think their bats will make it to them in time for the rioting to still be going?

[MaltonNecromancer]

The more I see of these riots, the more it feels like ancient Rome; panem et circenses. The criminals who are doing it are truly scum, but really, it just strikes me as the logical consequence of a society predicated on injustice and inequality. The banking classses drive my country into meltdown with their criminal ways (stealing millions), but they're somehow better/less evil than the abject poor and dispossessed (stealing from shops) because their crimes are too complicated to be easily understood.

The whole affair makes me sad.

I hope every BoLS member in London keeps safe and well.

[Drunkencorgimaster]

[QUOTE=DarkLink;153336]Seriously, how often do I ever troll people. And that's a rhetorical question. /QUOTE]

The "Troll" (or opposite "Fanboy") label seems to come down rather quickly these days.

[Drunkencorgimaster]

Oh yeah...one other thing: hang in there Britain! We still love 'ya!:)

[Emerald Rose Widow]

Good luck to all those effected by the riots, and I hope all our fellow UK BoLS members are ok if you are near the riots, or even if your not in the riots. I hope this is resolved in a way that is good for the people of britain as well.

[DarkLink]

Right, hopefully this gets sorted out quickly. Pointless, large scale violence (and, yes, this is pointless violence) isn't something anyone should want.


You mean like you did? Or is this a 'Do as I say, not as I do' situation?


Slight difference between taking a joking jab at a group (I like making fun of liberals, but I'm not very serious about it) and ranting about how someone's a troll.

If Brass Scorpion misunderstood my comment or took insult, then I'll clarify that no insult was meant. All I said, or intended to say at the least, was "I haven't heard about very many large scale riots like this in America, and oh hey look at those silly liberal college students..."



The "Troll" (or opposite "Fanboy") label seems to come down rather quickly these days.

People just take things too seriously. Not to sound like a hippy, but chill out dudes.

[Kieranator K82]

Hee's an idea: Have an announcement issued which states that rioters/looters will be shot on sight by law enforcement. All of a sudden, the numbers drop significantly, and only the lowest of the lowlifes will be left. Nobody cares if they get shot. And huzzah, order has been restored (somewhat)!

[Emerald Rose Widow]

Hee's an idea: Have an announcement issued which states that rioters/looters will be shot on sight by law enforcement. All of a sudden, the numbers drop significantly, and only the lowest of the lowlifes will be left. Nobody cares if they get shot. And huzzah, order has been restored (somewhat)!

The problem is with that, that in a civilized society the cops arent allowed to shoot a citizen unless they absolutely have to as an absolute last effort. They have to use non lethal means first before resorting to killing, and that isn't a good thing.

[eldargal]

Not to mention Britain pioneered policing by consent, wouldn't like to see that thrown away now. At least the Prime Minister has said water cannons will be provided and used.

[Kieranator K82]

It would seem I wouldn't make a very good cop. :(

[Necron2.0]

The problem is with that, that in a civilized society ...

Ha!! This isn't directed to you, ERW, but every time I hear "in a civilized society" I always want to scream "OPEN YOUR @#$!% EYES AND TAKE A LOOK AROUND! DOES THIS LOOK LIKE @#$!% CIVILIZATION TO YOU?!! IF SO, GET BACK IN THE TREE, YOU @#$!% MONKEY!!"

Like I said, I'm not directing that at you, ERW. Usually when I hear someone talking about civilization, it's someone waxing pedantic over their misguided views of the social sciences. They're usually sipping a latte, insisting that the murderers are the "real" victims, while the television streams video of eviscerated and/or dismembered corpses lying in the street. I'll be honest with you, if given a choice between the tender-hearted wisdom of some of these "progressive" social "scholars" and the "draconian" views of Niccolo Machiavelli, I'll take Machiavelli every damned day. Niccolo, at least, knew what he was talking about, having been on the losing end of a struggle against the Medici.

[eldargal]

Yes, but we have the army for crushing revolts, not the police. The police need to be able to maintain law and order peacefully after the revolt is crushed and you can't do that if you just krumped da chavs.;)

One thing that annoys me is when you get people say 'we can't use the military to suppress this, they haven't been used for that in hundreds of years!'. Well, no, the military was used to suppress various riots in the Days of May in1831, notably the Queens Square riot in Bristol and earlier in the Peterloo massacre of 1819. So its been a while, but not hundreds of years.

[Morgan Darkstar]

The police's job is to maintain order and protect the public.

The army's job is to Kill people

what i am getting at is

Police do the Policing = Win :)

Army do the Policing = Fail :(

Simples!

[Kieranator K82]

Okay since I didnt' explicitly state the police in my 'idea post,' then that proposition still stands. The army can kill the rioters/looters/lowlife hooligans. Nobody comes out looking bad.

[Gotthammer]

The Irish might disagree with you.

[Aldramelech]

Yes, but we have the army for crushing revolts, not the police. The police need to be able to maintain law and order peacefully after the revolt is crushed and you can't do that if you just krumped da chavs.;)

One thing that annoys me is when you get people say 'we can't use the military to suppress this, they haven't been used for that in hundreds of years!'. Well, no, the military was used to suppress various riots in the Days of May in1831, notably the Queens Square riot in Bristol and earlier in the Peterloo massacre of 1819. So its been a while, but not hundreds of years.

These "Medium C" tanks were deployed to Glasgow in 1919 for Riot Control, tanks were also deployed in London to quell unreast in the 1920's.

http://i749.photobucket.com/albums/xx135/andyblackmore/1919_Battle_of_George_Square_-_tanks_and_soldiers.jpg

[eldargal]

Argh, why did I forget the tanks in London during the 1926 General Strike! I wasn't aware of the Glasgow incident though, thanks Aldy.:)
http://news.bbcimg.co.uk/media/images/53509000/jpg/_53509098_003005662-2.jpg

[Denzark]

I have been away on exercise so haven't been able to comment fascistically on this. Our DS solution was to find out whichever para battalion is furthest away from an Afghan tour, 1 days refresher in public order from some of those splendid Royal Irish chaps and then get a proper shield wall going. Full size shields, not those poxy little round ones, and a proper shield wall stretches unbroken across the street.

It also has baton gunners behind ready to use their 'grazing' skills to bounce the baton rounds just right so they hit at head height.

Poxy little street rats.

[DarkLink]

The police's job is to maintain order and protect the public.

The army's job is to Kill people

what i am getting at is

Police do the Policing = Win :)

Army do the Policing = Fail :(

Simples!

Maybe more accurate to say that the police are the little whipping stick they used to use on unruly kids, while the army is the nail-studded baseball bat you keep under your pillow.

[Necron2.0]

The problem is armies make for a piss poor police force. People forget that their roles are diametrically opposed. A police force is meant to assess a situation, separate witness from victim from criminal, and act accordingly. They're supposed to think before they act. For an army that is NOT what you want. You want them to shoot first and ask ques ...... well, just shoot, shoot and keep shooting, stopping only to reload, and never question why. What you get when you put your army through "sensitivity training" and/or "cultural awareness training" is you get dead soldiers or those with mental disorders. A soldier is a killing instrument, not an administrative one.

[Drew da Destroya]

Maybe more accurate to say that the police are the little whipping stick they used to use on unruly kids, while the army is the nail-studded baseball bat you keep under your pillow.

Man, you must have a hard time sleeping, or some serious pillows.