Some Far Out Rumors for 6th

[DrBored]

Fat, massive, toadacious blocks of salt with these, guys. I mean huge. Moon sized. Like, if the moon was the size of the sun, then they would be moon sized blocks of salt that you should take, but they're more like sun-sized blocks of salt. I didn't believe them when I heard them second hand, but here they are.

As we get towards 6th edition, some things are rumored to be changing. White Dwarf is rumored to be going back to what they had before, with more battle reports and painting how-tos and less advertisements. Sisters of Battle is the poster child for the 'White Dwarf Codex' which may be getting more full-on Codices in the future depending on popularity. One such example would be for the Chaos Legions Codex, which would have a core, and then White Dwarf additions for other Legions as the months progress.

Oh by the way, Chaos Legions by March 1012 and 6th edition by October 2012, which will feature Eldar as the poster child. Heavy Xenos influence for 6th edition, including the long-awaited Tau update.

Here's a doozy. Fluff changes. (prepare for heavy summary) We're moving on from the 41st millenium into the 42nd. Yup. Here's the rumor: mankind's days are really waning. They're heading down the crapper fast and xenos, especially Necrons, are coming into quite the threat. Well, mankind just doesn't have the power, and now Necrons are threatening Chaos, and the Chaos forces are like 'well wtf guyz'. So, Chaos has to fight across the galaxy against the enemies that mankind were fighting against, perhaps even allying with loyalist forces against a common foe. This will be expanded on in the coming Codices, including Necron and Chaos Legions, which should set up for the big fluff change in 6th edition. Some of the rest sounded more like wish, opinion, and extrapolation; Void Dragon coming up, Primarchs coming back, Emperor's descendants being found by an unnamed portion of the Imperium in order to fight the Void Dragon, etc etc...

Now here are some other things that are founded in reality: Matt Ward? Gone. Don't expect him to be writing any more Codices. His baby was 5th edition, and now that 5th edition is up, Ward is done. Board Members for GW? 3 of the old geezers gone. Company-wide changes. Everything since Tyranids? Made for 6th edition.

Speaking of 6th edition again, the main rulebook that comes out is supposed to be 'the book to rule all books'. It'll have ways to include Superheavies and rules for Fliers in regular games, and should errata a lot of rules in Apocalypse, past FAQ's, and past Codices to make it all fit together. It'll have updated stuff for Planetstrike, Cities of Death, etc, perhaps even to make room for more expansions in the future.

Ugh. The person I heard this from is a good friend and reliable source, and the person *he* got this information from is an unnamed employee of a certain facet of our favorite gaming company that deals with items made out of a material that is notorious for melting if exposed to direct sunlight and heat. By the way, all those rule sets that Forgeworld has been making? They may suddenly find themselves approved for regular games.

I honestly feel tainted by a lot of this information. I'll be the first to say that so much of it is so unreal and so uncharacteristic for Games Workshop that it doesn't feel like it could happen at all. Moving the fluff forward? Having superheavies in a regular edition? Making Codex *supplements* exclusively through White Dwarf (and subsequently free a month later on their website like most White Dwarf stuff)? Knocking Space Marines down a notch?

But think about it. 5th edition has been the edition for the Imperium. Imperial Guard, Grey Knights, Space Wolves, Blood Angels, and of course Space Marines have all gotten Codices, and Black Templar and Dark Angels have been FAQ'd to match up. The only xenos forces we've seen have been Orks (which were technically still 4th edition), Tyranids, and Dark Eldar. And now Sisters of Battle are going to be covered. That leaves Tau, Orks (since they weren't really in 5th), Eldar, Chaos Marines, Necrons, and Chaos Daemons left to be covered. NONE of those are imperial forces, so it almost seems like they've been stacking the deck so that they can put a heavier focus on the xenos, which is a prime opportunity to advance the fluff. By advancing the fluff through xenos codices, they can then re-glorify the imperial forces by updating them further into 6th edition after they've figured all that stuff out.

Also, Chaos Marines have been a group of much attention. The Horus Heresy novels, Black Crusade RPG, and features as main villains in many a video game. They have a lot of new fluff that hasn't been explored before, and a lot of new material has been created that has kept them in the limelight, even if they haven't been on the gaming tables. They are Imperial Enemy No. 1. They are a very popular force. To have them suddenly take the spotlight in new fluff in a new edition only makes sense. A force as potent as the Chaos Legions, Legions of marines that number in the thousands, whose leader commands the last Black Fortress (one of the few great weapons against the C'Tan), is a force that can wreak proper havoc again, either in the form of a new Black Crusade, or in the form of a totally different type of war. Thus far, Chaos has seemed content to chill out in their warp homes within the Maelstrom and Eye of Terror, with the 13th Black Crusade being the last great push, and that was solely against the Imperium and anything else that happened to be in the way. There are many an enemy that Chaos can fight besides the waning Imperium, such as the Necron that they abhor for their desire to snuff out the sensation that Chaos enjoys.

There are a lot of other things that simply don't fit. We've already heard rumors about fliers, but the superheavies thing is a stretch. 'One book to rule them all' is a bit of a stretch, as that would cannibalize all of the books that have already been printed. Also, Forgeworld being brought into the fold doesn't make sense either. Though they've been pumping out a lot of new stuff, their business model is built as a boutique, and if they suddenly shift gears to mass-produce their stuff to satisfy the new net lists that come out, then that will completely undo their business model. On the other hand, Games Workshop has kicked metal straight out, so to get all their factories devoted to resin might end up increasing Forgeworld's production as well simply by volume of production.

Anyway, like I said. Salt, salt, salt. Not only am I hearing all of this second-hand, but it's difficult to weed out what's speculation on the speaker's part, and what he intended as rumor. I suppose we'll just see if he's right. The first hint would be Chaos Marines in March 2012 huh?

But anyway...
http://www.socialsecuritydisabilitylawyer.us/.a/6a00e55232e8a488340115715cc78a970c-800wi

Left Field. I'm from it.

[Galadren]

http://stevetilford.com/wp-content/uploads/2011/01/SaltMine.jpg

Salt.

[DrBored]

http://stevetilford.com/wp-content/uploads/2011/01/SaltMine.jpg

Salt.

Might not be enough.

[Dalleron]

The previous rumurs were pretty far out, so what's new?

The fluff in the rule book means diddly. So they shift the timeline forward. Means nothing. And if everything is going down the toilet, they could just be paving the way for the return of the primarchs, on both sides. Who knows about the fluff.

And I can't really see GW "giving away" codex' through the WD. That's a loss of 20$ Cdn a copy. I don't know what they cost elsewhere.

I am interested to see what 6th ed holds though. Bring it on. 5th ed kinda sucks for me.

[eldargal]

I've heard from sources within GW that Ward is getting more involved with 40k not less, factor in everything else either contradicting other, more reliable rumours or going against decades of GW policy I don't think there is any substance to these at all.

[DrBored]

I've heard from sources within GW that Ward is getting more involved with 40k not less, factor in everything else either contradicting other, more reliable rumours or going against decades of GW policy I don't think there is any substance to these at all.

That's what I said. None of it seems like GW. I would have believed something along the lines of "Well, 6th edition is going to be more of the same fluff, refusing to go past the 41st millenium, milking that year 49,999.99999 to its last drop. Chaos is happening, big whoop. They're finally getting around to Tau and other things, but Black Templar and Dark Angels, and regular Space Marines are going to have higher priority. Flier rules are new, and Matt Ward is writing the 6th edition rulebook and all Codices from now on. Absolutely nothing that improves the fluff or GW's PR policies is happening at all."

That's what sounds more like GW.

[Brass Scorpion]

I have little doubt that 40K is getting a revision next year because the recent 4-year revision cycles for both Warhammer games have netted GW a lot of money, but other than that I have little confidence in any of the specific rumors about particular rules at this point. It's just too far away and I'm not hearing these rumors from the "right people" yet, either personal contacts or public sources. When you start seeing a narrower focus on certain specifics and converging from different directions, then it's time to start scrutinizing them for veracity. Until then these are just fun stories.

[Necron_Lord]

I've heard from sources within GW that Ward is getting more involved with 40k not less, factor in everything else either contradicting other, more reliable rumours or going against decades of GW policy I don't think there is any substance to these at all.

Agreed. Mat Ward won't be doing any more 40k stuff, so he might become a board member?! I'm just hoping that there won't be Space Marines in the 6e boxed set.

[UltramarineFan]

Agreed. Mat Ward won't be doing any more 40k stuff, so he might become a board member?! I'm just hoping that there won't be Space Marines in the 6e boxed set.

The rumour is DA vs Chaos so bad luck..

Agree with others about the 6th ed rumours though, the changes are just too big and just so far away from what we have now that it doesn't seem believable, so far there are VERY few rumours that I have even considered as being true, lots of them don't sound like something that GW would produce, just wish listing (though personally I disagree strongly with that person's wishes...)

[slxiii]

You know how we know that's false? Plot advancement.

[Lockark]

You lost me at the art about Necrons being the guys who beat everyone up. With the newer necron fluff in the 5th ed rules book and blood angle codex, their has been a drive to make the necrons more like the tomb kings. A drive to give the necrons some sort of narrative to them. Well the basic necron warriors are mindless the lords are greedy/cunning/insane/intelligent/ect

Many necrons are now godless after the War in the Heavens, and now are left to their own devices. So basically you have these armies of mindless robots being lead by a lord. How dose the lord feel about his people being turned into necrons? Apathy? Sorrow? Frustration? guilt? Thows kind of questions help give the necrons more character and make them less "faceless".

I would not be surprised if in future fluff the necrons are as likely to fight each other as other races. (Like the Tomb Kings.)



But for them to ditch all of that and go back to the original fluff of them being mindless machines? eehhhh..... Seems odd.

[Wildeybeast]

Oh by the way, Chaos Legions by March1012 and 6th edition by October 2012, which will feature Eldar as the poster child. Heavy Xenos influence for 6th edition, including the long-awaited Tau update.

Here's a doozy. Fluff changes. (prepare for heavy summary) We're moving on from the 41st millenium into the 42nd.

Who did these rumours come from, crazy old Doc Brown? So not only are we having a new ruleset, GW has also found a way to bend time and change dates!? Either that or they are planning to rename and rebrand their most popular game to the catchily titled Warhammer 41,000. I don't which I find more believable :D

[eldargal]

Actually a Chaos Legions codex was mentioned by ghost21 who is quite reliable, so that could be true. But he also says the poster children for 6th ed are Black Templars, in the sense of them being in the boxed set. The rest of it seems absurd, I could see GW moving the timeline forward to give them space to breath, but not 'advance the plot' in the sense of anything changing.

[DrBored]

Who did these rumours come from, crazy old Doc Brown? So not only are we having a new ruleset, GW has also found a way to bend time and change dates!? Either that or they are planning to rename and rebrand their most popular game to the catchily titled Warhammer 41,000. I don't which I find more believable :D

'twas a typo, but nice catch :P

The thing that makes it believable for me is that between the year 40,000 and 49,999 it can still be called 'Warhammer 40,000'. The plot has been stuck between the year 40,000 and 40,999, which is actually a very short period of time when you consider Warhammer fluff. When Space Marines, Eldar, and others live for hundreds of years, it creates a very compact timeline that doesn't allow for space to expand into. Most of the fluff that's been coming out in books and whatnot has been in very small sectors of the galaxy over very short periods of time, or has been about the time before the year 40,000. It's not too much of a stretch to think that GW might want to shake things up a bit by advancing the plot by a single minute in order to get to the year 41,000.

But anyway. I could believe Chaos Legions in March. It seems fitting according to some of the rumors we've been hearing (the book would be just before 6th like Orks was before 5th, but geared entirely for 6th edition), and if 6th is going to come out in the year 2012, it makes sense that it would come out in the summer like 5th did, and if that's the case, between Sisters of Battle, Necrons, and whatever happens in the Winter, March is really the only month left for a big release like Chaos.

[GrenAcid]

Time line go forward?? HoooRayyyyyy!!!!....More chaos/xeno love?? HooooRayyyyyy!!! I was geting sick, seeing Imperium as masters of galaxy(Im thinking about dex power).

[madlib]

6th edition by October 2012, which will feature Eldar as the poster child

No. The Imperium is at the heart of all that is 40k. It's about humanity's struggle to survive and protect its loose empire. All other factions, chaos/xenos are compliments to that mythos. Expanding on the lore of xenos factions makes sense; turning 40k mythos on its head does not. Furthermore, from a purely business standpoint it also makes little sense considering the popularity of Space Marines and other Imperial factions. When most people think 40k, they think Space Marines not Eldar. Space Marines will remain the Iconic badge of 40k and I really don't ever see that changing.


So, Chaos has to fight across the galaxy against the enemies that mankind were fighting against, perhaps even allying with loyalist forces against a common foe

Again, no. This goes against the very grain of a mythos built up over decades. Chaos is the arch enemy and the struggle against Chaos is what defines and drives the Imperium. The very idea of "allying" with Chaos is anathema to what the Imperium is about.

Also the idea of Chaos having to fight some kind of conventional war to survive sounds silly. Chaos is this nebulous power/evil; a corrupting force of the warp. It's beyond protecting borders or "empires" and beyond its physical manifestations, ie: traitor marines, cultists, or demons which are not necessarily even "allied" with one another.


The whole thing feels like trolling to me.

[Chuck777]

Also the idea of Chaos having to fight some kind of conventional war to survive sounds silly. Chaos is this nebulous power/evil; a corrupting force of the warp. It's beyond protecting borders or "empires" and beyond its physical manifestations, ie: traitor marines, cultists, or demons which are not necessarily even "allied" with one another.



Except we're talking about Chaos fighting an enemy that finds the warp anathema - Necrons. The C'tan, especially if the Void Dragon arises again, would be well placed to create an anti-warp weapon that would necessitate Chaos to wage a conventional war against the Toasters.

The Imperium working with Chaos is a very large fluff change, but then again so was the idea that Necrons and BA would team up against Tyranids, or a lot of the tom foolery Ward wrote for the GK. We've been witnessing the subtle changes GW's made to the fluff, perhaps 6th edition really will shake things up!

Plus, if you base line it, the Imperium is just loosing ground faster, its not exactly a big fluff change in and of itself.

[madlib]

There's a difference between isolated events covered in a codex and fundamental thematic changes. In saying that the timeline will be advanced and suddenly the Imperium will find itself "allying" with Chaos, you are essentially undermining or deconstructing if you will the very thing that underpins the whole mythos.

Moreover, suddenly making the Eldar the "poster boys" of your franchise is a major shift in market focus and philosophy. In fact, I think it would be a terrible business decision. Taking the focus off of your iconic product and shifting it to something peripheral makes little sense.

I call bs.

p.s. No offense intended to fans of the Eldar and using the term "peripheral" to describe them was probably a bit harsh, but I was trying to make a point.

[flekkzo]

There's a difference between isolated events covered in a codex and fundamental thematic changes. In saying that the timeline will be advanced and suddenly the Imperium will find itself "allying" with Chaos, you are essentially undermining or deconstructing if you will the very thing that underpins the whole mythos.

Fighting alongside chaos effectively means you are going to be corrupted. Imperial Guard? Corrupted. Most Space Marines? Enough corrupted to bring about a heresy. Grey Knights? Going to feel very very lonely. Mars? Better bring out Mr Void Dragon soon.

I buy the Necrons waking up idea, I don't buy the Imperial and Choas together. If anything, Chaos would be fighting by taking over Imperial armies and worlds.

[Demonus]

The enemy of my enemy....is still Chaos Scum. For Russ!

[Groglurk]

Oh if only half of these rumors were true. The changes to GW's bureaucracy and the perspective shifting away from Space Marines are especially appealing. I really want to believe this stuff, but given that even the OP is highly skeptical about their accuracy, the chances seem impossibly slim.

[DF3CT]

I see no problem "turning the mythos on its head". 40k is a story of sorts and a story needs to progress.

-Find the Emperors descendents and gather them. Perhaps a secret society buried within the Impeerium to consolidate power.

-Wake up the machine god and flood Mars with Necron. A massive distress beacon not seen since the days of the Horus Heresy is detected in the Terran system.
A large number of Mechanicus choose to worship the newly risen C'tan/Machine god.
This is bad for the Imperiums resource and armament.

-Chaos siding with the Imperium? Perhaps the surviving renegade primarchs do something exceptionally rash and attempt contact with anyone willing to listen to them with Imperial authority.
This doesn't have to be a far reaching alliance and perhaps with such an act, one or two of these chaos primarchs are cast out by the chaos powers and find themselves in limbo.
Remember, here are traitor legions that aren't baby baking and blood drinking chaos monstrosities.
Perhaps a blanket pardon to those traitor legions willing to accept the Emperors light and bring more marine strength back to the fold...*ponders*

This would cause the Grey knights and most likely the sisters to scorn and turn their back on the Imperium of man.

[Bigred]

Things that keep coming up consistantly from all over the place:

-6th Edition Q2-4 2012
-Chaos Legions Q1-2 2012
-6th Edition Boxed set containing CSM vs (someone)

Just saying....

[DrBored]

Things that keep coming up consistantly from all over the place:

-6th Edition Q2-4 2012
-Chaos Legions Q1-2 2012
-6th Edition Boxed set containing CSM vs (someone)

Just saying....

Well, if that's the case, maybe some of this other stuff is true... I suppose we'll see.

I keep hearing rumors about the Void Dragon awakening and whatnot.

[- 7eAL -]

Oh if only half of these rumors were true. The changes to GW's bureaucracy and the perspective shifting away from Space Marines are especially appealing. I really want to believe this stuff, but given that even the OP is highly skeptical about their accuracy, the chances seem impossibly slim.
Only half, please. The other half of these rumours are not appealing.



I see no problem "turning the mythos on its head". 40k is a story of sorts and a story needs to progress.

Frankly, backstory development could present as much if not more progress. What do we know about the 13 Black Crusades? Next to nothing. What happened, who fought, and why have they all failed so far, when the Horus Heresy was so very nearly successful?

What of the Age of Apostasy? That's a time of internal chaos for the Imperium - did those changes truly make the Imperium stronger, or weaker?

All the minor races that the Imperium has tried to wipe out - if not for Dark Heresy, Rogue Trader, and Deathwatch, we wouldn't have seen them again. Collect them under the Tau! What are their cultures and technologies? What are their political and astronomic relationships?

What are the Eldar doing?! It's been ten thousand years since the Fall and they're about as active as a dead fish. They harass Imperial worlds, get attacked by Tyranids, and float about in space. Surely an ancient race that is all about focus and concentration and single-minded purpose could get something done in ten thousand years? The Imperium has had all sorts of problems all the time - do the Eldar lead some kind of perfectly charmed life?



-Find the Emperors descendents and gather them. Perhaps a secret society buried within the Impeerium to consolidate power.

The Sensei and the Illuminati again? That's far too convoluted, they can only be represented on a small scale like Dark Heresy, and they have terrible names. No thank you.




-Wake up the machine god and flood Mars with Necron. A massive distress beacon not seen since the days of the Horus Heresy is detected in the Terran system.
A large number of Mechanicus choose to worship the newly risen C'tan/Machine god.
This is bad for the Imperiums resource and armament.

"Bad"? Mars is heavily armed and sits right next to Terra. Mars is also the technological powerhouse that maintains Terra - anything that breaks is fixed by the Mechanicum. It isn't difficult to imagine that the Mechanicus has a device that will remotely unplug the Golden Throne or disconnect the Astronomican, crippling all Warp travel so that Terra loses contact with all incoming reinforcements. If Mars becomes Necron, it's instant game over - Perfect! Finish Him! Fatality!

The Imperium doesn't have the Emperor card to play this time, so chances of recovery are slim to none, and slim is stuck in the Golden Throne.




-Chaos siding with the Imperium? Perhaps the surviving renegade primarchs do something exceptionally rash and attempt contact with anyone willing to listen to them with Imperial authority.
This doesn't have to be a far reaching alliance and perhaps with such an act, one or two of these chaos primarchs are cast out by the chaos powers and find themselves in limbo.
Remember, here are traitor legions that aren't baby baking and blood drinking chaos monstrosities.
Perhaps a blanket pardon to those traitor legions willing to accept the Emperors light and bring more marine strength back to the fold...*ponders*

A pardon? The reappearance of two expunged Legions is more likely. On the other hand, I could see Alpha Legion and Night Lords coming in to save the day ... only to enslave the population for a while to get some work done.

[Anon!]

Except we're talking about Chaos fighting an enemy that finds the warp anathema - Necrons. The C'tan, especially if the Void Dragon arises again, would be well placed to create an anti-warp weapon that would necessitate Chaos to wage a conventional war against the Toasters.

Necrons already have one - the Pylons of Cadia.

[whitestar333]

The Imperium doesn't have the Emperor card to play this time, so chances of recovery are slim to none, and slim is stuck in the Golden Throne.


Unless they unplug the Golden Throne, only to find out that killing the Emperor of man only reincarnates him. The emperor returns to fight against the Necron threat.

Not saying it will happen, but trying to point out that GW can do whatever they want with their fluff, and ANY dynamic change is better than what we have right now.

I'd like to think that GW is carefully studying the [relatively small] successes of other game companies to better understand what customers really want, and are starting to learn and adapt. Privateer Press, for example, is constantly advancing their fluff, and I'm sure that GW knows that and, given PP's extreme growth (200% increase in sales in less than a year), it's possible that GW will take a play from their book and start advancing their fluff.

[Anggul]

This sounds like a complete load of rubbish.

Some of it actually sounds half-decent which leads me to believe that it's a load of crap, GW are not capable of pleasing people much, and they certainly wouldn't make the Imperium weaker in the fluff, it would actually be cool if things actually registered as a threat to them and we know we can't have that now can we?

[Prodigalson]

You lost me at the timeline moving forward. I've been hearing about the death of the emperor for nearing twenty years now, and I don't believe that at all. You hear it every time a edition comes close to changing.

I'm still banking for Tau in January-March and not chaos legions.

[flekkzo]

The Sensei and the Illuminati again? That's far too convoluted, they can only be represented on a small scale like Dark Heresy, and they have terrible names. No thank you.


The God-Emperor of mankind already has descendants. They are called Primarchs and Space Marines. I think that's good enough really.

If GW wants to "revive" the emperor it would mean a new set of unification wars within the Imperium, and a healthy dose of overkill to eradicate the parts the emperor wouldn't agree with (which is, a LOT outside the Space Marines). I think that could play well with the current state of our real world, just with the idea of one real hero for mankind. Also it would put even more emphasis on chaos as the enemy, and if we could get three equally large factions (at least in the codex sense) in Imperial, Chaos, and Xenos, I'd be happy.

Then again I'd settle for anything new happening. At least move into the next millennia properly. It's 40k for 10,000 years, use those!

[DF3CT]

The God-Emperor of mankind already has descendants. They are called Primarchs and Space Marines. I think that's good enough really.

If GW wants to "revive" the emperor it would mean a new set of unification wars within the Imperium, and a healthy dose of overkill to eradicate the parts the emperor wouldn't agree with (which is, a LOT outside the Space Marines). I think that could play well with the current state of our real world, just with the idea of one real hero for mankind. Also it would put even more emphasis on chaos as the enemy, and if we could get three equally large factions (at least in the codex sense) in Imperial, Chaos, and Xenos, I'd be happy.

Then again I'd settle for anything new happening. At least move into the next millennia properly. It's 40k for 10,000 years, use those!

They aren't really his descendents. Primarchs = clones with an essence dumped in them yes?

Marines have the bio material of said primarchs.

The emperor is an immortal that has been around throughout human history....he's tossed it down with the ladies on more than a few occasions and it isn't stretching it to think that there are many hundreds of his long lost grand child genetic material humping around the galaxy, mixed amongst various levels of society.

I liked the idea that the Illuminati was rounding them up for a mass sacrifice to the Emperor on his throne to bring him back.


Honestly...I'd even be down for the reincarnation of the lost/killed Primarchs, struggling to get their power back and deal with disbelievers.

Could be that maybe chaos won't "ally" with the Imperium, but some of the more "stable" minded surviving renegade Primarchs may see the threat of the Necrons and the vulnerability of both the Imperium and the renegades.....perhaps Magnus knows a secret for bringing back his deceased brothers whom the renegades betrayed thousands of years ago.....*ponders*