a beginner's Eldar list--1000pts

[Occam]

My buddy is starting Warhammer and wants to play Eldar. What would a good beginner list be to give him some variety, fun and punching power at 1,000 pts.

[davel]

simple rule go with what you love

does he like the aspect warriors
or the fast jetbikes?
physcic powers or wriathguard?
or flying tanks?

with eldar they are unforgiving. They can win games. currently it's tough to table an opponent some play missions. But accept if you make a mistake it can go horribly wrong.

dave l

[thecactusman17]

Eldar have a metric ton of options, pulling them together into a cohesive whole is the really difficult part. We really need an idea of what aspects of the Eldar he likes to make a useful suggestion.

[Occam]

I think he really likes the idea of psychic powers and flying tanks/jetbikes. He said he wanted to manipulate and control the battle while setting up firing lanes, if that helps.

[Bean]

I think he really likes the idea of psychic powers and flying tanks/jetbikes. He said he wanted to manipulate and control the battle while setting up firing lanes, if that helps.

That is what Eldar do well.

145: Farseer: Doom, Fortune, Runes of Warding, Spirit Stones

120: 10x Dire Avengers
120: Wave Serpent, Missile launchers

120: 10x Dire Avengers
120: Wave Serpent, Missile launchers

115: Fire Prism
115: Fire Prism
115: Fire Prism

That's a pretty straight-forward mechanized eldar list. It's all stuff that's good, gives you the tanks and the psycker (warlock jetbike squad is good, but tough to fit in 1000 points effectively). That's where i'd tell your friend to start.

Ah, also--it's thirty points short. I'm not sure what you spend those on, but there's bound to be something amusing to get for thirty points.

[Occam]

Thank you. What would you put in if you had a few more points?
What do those psychic powers do? I thought that Farseers got 4 powers.

[Demonus]

Bean's list is a good one, but I would make sure you have stones on your prisms/wave serpents. A moblie army that cant move is a dead army :)

make the DA squads 9 each if need be for the extra 20pts.

yes farseers can buy more powers, but may only use 2 per turn (if they have spirit stones) or 1 if they dont.

[Occam]

Cool. Thanks all.

So how would this kind of list scale up? What are the general ideas and tactics supposed to be around this list?

And on a completely different note, what on Earth is the power "Eldritch Storm" supposed to do? It just seems really odd. When would one use this power?

[davel]

eldritch storm I don't see often it's main benefits is a anti horde weapon and to spin tanks to get hits on side and rear facings

as for scaling up more troops da in transports
fire dragons in transports are popular to deal with other mech
I'd recommend an assault unit so that you can shift opponent from objectives

dave

[thecactusman17]

Eldritch storm is a power that can be somewhat effective as a supporting effect vs. vehicles, much like the other Eldar Psychic Powers are great support abilities. Because the power causes vehicles to expose side or rear armor, it is very possible to use this power, then hit a vehicle such as a Leman Russ or Battlewagon on the much softer flank or rear with followup attacks. If you have a few vehicles tightly packed in a squadron, you could even manage to hit all of them and expose an entire vehicle squadrons' weak points.

And hey, pinning is hardly a bad side effect vs. hordes of low toughness enemies.

[Bean]

Thank you. What would you put in if you had a few more points?
What do those psychic powers do? I thought that Farseers got 4 powers.

Doom targets an enemy unit and allows you to re-roll rolls to wound against that unit--it's the Eldar generic offensive power. Eldritch storm does damage, but Doom is usually a better use of one of your powers.

Fortune allows a friendly unit to re-roll saves--mostly, this will be used to let a tank (he can use it while embarked) re-roll the cover save it gets from going flat-out.

You can get more powers on the Farseer, but since he can only use two a turn, it's not usually a great use of points.

Spirit stones on tanks are reasonable, but certainly not necessary. Not being able to move does suck, but stunned is one of the least common damage results. They're worthwhile filler. I wouldn't drop much to bring more of them. They're more important on Wave Serpents than they are on Fire Prisms.


For scaling up the list, you pretty much do what others have said--add another squad of DA in a serpent, maybe a five-man Fire Dragon squad in a serpent or ten-man Scorpions in a serpent (Scorpions are generally a little better than Banshees, though both are acceptable). You can swap that Farseer out for a Jetbike farseer and add in a jetbike warlock council (four or five warlocks on jetbikes, a couple of singing spears, a couple of destructors, enhance and embolden--make sure to play Fortune on the Farseer so they get those re-rollable saves).

You can add in cheap fast troop choices: 72 points buys you three jetbikes and a Shuriken Cannon. You can play up to twelve in a squad (72 for three, 144 for six, etc) but you should always take them in sets of three with Shuriken Cannons.

That's pretty much the army, and it's a reasonably good army--the best the Eldar codex can put out, certainly.

[eldargal]

I find Banshees more useful than Scorpions, but it is a matter of personal taste. On Doomed enemies those power weapon attacks seem to count for more than the Scorpions extra attacks. Of course it depends on the enemy, against low armour, low toughness enemies scorpions are more useful.

[Bean]

I find Banshees more useful than Scorpions, but it is a matter of personal taste. On Doomed enemies those power weapon attacks seem to count for more than the Scorpions extra attacks. Of course it depends on the enemy, against low armour, low toughness enemies scorpions are more useful.

Doom shifts the numbers, it's true. If you run numbers without Doom, Scorpions are better against most targets: Terminators are basically the only exception. The two are very close, though. Scorpions are tougher, but it's fair to say that Fleet is more valuable out of the transport. Scorpion Exarch with his fist is substantially better than the Banshee Exarch.

[eldargal]

Well, I still have more luck with Banshees even sans doom, I don't know why. I honestly think it is a personal style thing more than anything else.

[Bean]

Well, I still have more luck with Banshees even sans doom, I don't know why. I honestly think it is a personal style thing more than anything else.

Fair. I'm just saying: I've done the math. Also, the best player I know plays Eldar and prefers Scorpions. I'm going to keep recommending Scorpions.

[eldargal]

Oh, I am too. I just recommend trying both to see which you get a feel for.:)

[Anggul]

Indeed, most of the Eldar units are decent, you just have to be selective about who you give transports, as that's where the points rack up for them. Scorpions, being Infiltrators, work better than Banshees without support, as that's their job, whereas Banshees can really cut through heavily armoured guys with Doom. Without Doom, however, their inability to cause enough wounds means even with power weapons you won't kill that many dudes. In 1500 I only have the Scorpions and the Farseer goes with one of my Avenger squads. Any higher though, and I take the Banshees in a serpent with the Farseer, who throws his spear at tanks and dooms things for the Banshees to charge.

It really does depend on how he wants to play though. If he wants all of his army to be fast and quick to reposition, then Scorpions might not be a great idea, however it may be possible to use them to herd enemy units into the fire of your fire prisms etc, and they certainly get up close fairly quickly due to Infiltrating/outflanking.

[Occam]

Heh. It's funny. Another gentleman who plays both flavors of Eldar told me "Fire Dragons...Fire Dragons everywhere...Fire dragons are your friends."
Or can/should you only take those in higher point games?

[eldargal]

Fire Dragons in a Wave Serpent really are a must, even if you take Fire Prisms or bright lances. The Fire Dragons are much more reliable when it comes to taking down AV13/14.


I build my list around Banshees with a Farseer so I make it work. Of course I often takes Scorpions as well if I can. And Fire Dragons.

[Demonus]

hmm i have just the opposite in my games. 7 times out of 10, I am getting a shaken/stun result so Stones are worth their weight in gold for my vehicles.

also I prefer banshees over scorpions, especially on doomed opponents. everyone makes their 3+ save way to easily for scorpions in my experience, and I use the glaive on my exarch.

its all a matter of personal preference though, scorpion models look cool and can cause some damage, but so can banshees if the dice roll your way.

[Bean]

Stones don't do anything for Shaken results--they just reduced stunned to shaken. Noting lots of "shaken/stunned" results doesn't constitute a good argument in favor of stones, since only the stunned results count--and, again, they're not a particularly common result.

Really, only destroyed and shaken results are particularly common.

[Anggul]

Heh. It's funny. Another gentleman who plays both flavors of Eldar told me "Fire Dragons...Fire Dragons everywhere...Fire dragons are your friends."
Or can/should you only take those in higher point games?

Yup, Fire Dragons are excellent, probably the best unit in the codex. They're the 'point-and-click' unit, you point them at something, and it's probably dead. If you can, set up your units to deter or react to the inevitable retribution toward them, but either way if you pick a nice target, they'll make up their points and more. Land Raider? Gone. Monstrous creature? Melted.