New to Fantasy

[Kalz]

Well its as the title says i am a 40k player who wants to try out fantasy i've decided on chaos daemons (despite their reputation from 7th) and i was wondering if anyone had any advice about how they play and what type of armies actually work thanks in advance.

[BrokenWing]

Remember these words:

If it is going to fight in close combat, it has full command.

If you can afford to take alot of guys in a squad, do it, especially if it's going to fight in close combat. This is not a game of 10 guys at a time.

Fortunately you're playing one of the more remarkably unbalanced armies in the game, so you shouldn't have much trouble unless you lose combat, which is pretty brutal on daemons.

[Chronowraith]

If you can afford to take alot of guys in a squad, do it, especially if it's going to fight in close combat. This is not a game of 10 guys at a time.

I can't stress this enough. 10 Bloodletters is not enough. 10 Daemonettes is definitely not enough. If you want a unit to smash face, they should number 15 at the smallest and ideally 20 (or more depending on the specific unit in question).

The only units that should be run in small numbers should be Flamers, Bloodcrushers, Flesh Hounds, etc.

Personally, I suggest using heralds over Greater Daemons, but that's my choice. You'll draw far fewer evil glances using Heralds and they aren't going to be sniped by warmachines.

My favorite Daemon army is one that uses a lot of Bloodletters, one large unit of Tzeentch horrors, some flesh hounds, and then as many flamers as you can fit in your rare slot. Round that out with a Khorne herald, a khorne BSB, and a tzeentch herald and there you go. I've only ever lost against lizardmen with Lore of Life spam using that list.

[BrokenWing]

Given the amazing charge range of that list, I'm not surprised.

But yes, I'd say Bloodletters should be around 20 man units and you might consider taking something like Daemonettes in a Horde of 30-50.

But this coming from that guy that fields two units of 72 Marauders in 6,000 points, so.

[Chronowraith]

But yes, I'd say Bloodletters should be around 20 man units and you might consider taking something like Daemonettes in a Horde of 30-50.

Agreed. Daemonettes should definitely be run in larger groups and Bloodletters definitely work best in units of 20 (for a ~2000 point list at least).

To the OP, if you give us an idea of what kind of things you are looking for in a list we could give more specifics, but, at this point we can only give vague advice (most of which isn't even army specific).

[Kalz]

Thank you so much for the advice so far, it may be as you say generic but to someone like me, who is a vet 40k player but never touched fantasy, so your advice is very helpful and also gives me an initial idea of what works in fantasy so i can have a rough idea of what i will play against, well either way its a lot more than i had before reading the comments, as for specifics i like the idea of either a khorne and slaanesh focus list with lots of fast heavy hitting charges or a very tzentch rain down the flames of hell on them, but honestly i dont know which way would work best, money wise i would prefer khorne as my blood letter count is near 60 already lol :D and that was in 40k hehe also side note any coversion ideas for 3 soul grinders?

[BrokenWing]

In my experience fighting with and against demons, just about anything works. Bloodletters and Blood Crushers just about define "fast" with the right flags.

Soul Grinders...wait until Storm of Magic comes out and see what sort of monster (if any) Demons get. Otherwise...Soul Grinders are a bit large for anything but some sort of weird Greater Demon...and even then. Demons don't really have anything in Fantasy on the scale of an Arach Spider or Necro Sphinx.

[Chronowraith]

Thank you so much for the advice so far, it may be as you say generic but to someone like me, who is a vet 40k player but never touched fantasy, so your advice is very helpful and also gives me an initial idea of what works in fantasy so i can have a rough idea of what i will play against, well either way its a lot more than i had before reading the comments, as for specifics i like the idea of either a khorne and slaanesh focus list with lots of fast heavy hitting charges or a very tzentch rain down the flames of hell on them, but honestly i dont know which way would work best, money wise i would prefer khorne as my blood letter count is near 60 already lol :D and that was in 40k hehe also side note any coversion ideas for 3 soul grinders?


Khorne and Slaanesh work pretty well together. I'd suggest a couple units of 20 or so Bloodletters, a large horde of daemonettes (40ish), and then some steeds of slaanesh, flesh hounds, and some bloodcrushers for speed and hitting power. Finally take a couple of khorne heralds and a slaanesh herald with magic. Any spare points leftover put towards whatever else you want that attracts your eye.

The way this army works is you use your large units to hold up your enemies units and then flank charge with the steeds and bloodcrushers. Flesh hounds go after artillery, scouts, skirmishers, other small and irritating units.

That gives you a decent sized army with strong hitting power, no ranged attacks, and minimal magic. You'll definately want magic. If you could spare the points I'd argue to take a tzeentch herald with a mount of some kind. Demon magic is particularly strong.

For larger point games throw in a greater demon of your choice (Bloodthirster for face smashing, Keeper of Secrets for more precise face smashing, Tzeentch for magic, and Nurgle to lock down enemy units for awhile).

[Kalz]

hey again guys thank you so much your really helping me get to grips with all this, i'll be going out soon and playing some games to get a feel for what i am actually doing 2 more quick questions if i can be so cheeky could anyone explain fantasy daemons in terms of 40k daemons to me please (if possible if not no worries)~ i'd say my knowledge of fantasy rules is that i know the rules but i dont know how to use them to my benefit yet, also with flesh hounds as artillery killers what sort of squad size a i looking at?

[BrokenWing]

They really operate in alot of the same ways, except Fantasy Daemons are actually a good army. You don't have that army division/ deep strike nonsense going on. But take for example a Bloodletter. In 40k it kills things with good armor. In fantasy it kills things with good armor. It's just that generally stuff like that is actually nastier in Fantasy. Take the Greater Demons for example, a Bloodthirster in Fantasy is legions above a Bloodthirster in 40k and about 2 or 300 points more expensive.

[Chronowraith]

hey again guys thank you so much your really helping me get to grips with all this, i'll be going out soon and playing some games to get a feel for what i am actually doing 2 more quick questions if i can be so cheeky could anyone explain fantasy daemons in terms of 40k daemons to me please (if possible if not no worries)~ i'd say my knowledge of fantasy rules is that i know the rules but i dont know how to use them to my benefit yet, also with flesh hounds as artillery killers what sort of squad size a i looking at?

Well, most of the units operate pretty similar. Bloodletters do well against high toughness or high armor opponents. Plaguebearers are great tarpits due to their special abilties which make them more survivable. Tzeentch Horrors are better at ranged attacks. Bloodcrushers aren't the fastest cavalry but they crush faces. I'm sure you get the point.

The Fantasy army plays differently than 40k though. Most of this stems from how different the two game systems really are from one another. In 40k you have two halves, one arrives early and the other arrives piecemeal throughout the game. This doesn't happen with fantasy demons. They all start on the table unless I'm forgetting some unit that possesses the Ambush rule (which I don't think any do). The other big change from 40k to fantasy are the unique movement values for each unit. This helps determine the role of most units. Faster units do better at flanking roles, warmachine hunters, and scout hunters. Many other differences abound, but I could probably spend all day talking about them and then you'd just see a wall of text and probably move along and find something better to do with your time (like playing the game!)

As for the flesh hounds, I prefer a unit of 5+ but I do believe the minimum size is 3. If you can keep them alive along enough they will still kill most artillery/warmachines (minus the hellcannon, stay away from that thing).

[BrokenWing]

Minus the Hellcannon? Aw...but the Hellcannon loves you. ;). Just ask mine.