Grey Knights 1500pts confusion

[Duncndisorderly]

Due to my staggering ineptitude i cant seem to work out a 1500pts grey knights list and could use a little (a lot) of help. As you can see i fall squarely into the "i want to use all of the toys" catergory, help please and ta!

HQ

inquisitor in termie armour and retinue = 1 x jokaero, 1 x msytic and 1 x flagellant

Elite

5 man Purifiers + incinerator, psilencer and 2 x halberd and psybolts
Razorback with psybolt ammo for purifeirs

Troops

5 man terminator squad + banner, psicannon, psibolts, 2 x facions and 1 halberd

10 man strike squad + 3 x facions, 3 x halberd, 1 hammer, psilencer, psibolts, incinerator
Rhino for strike squad

fast

5 man interceptor + stave, halberd, 2 x hammer and a psilencer

Heavy

Dreadknight with Gat psilencer and psicannon

Dreadknight with Gat psilencer and incinerator

[isotope99]

Some thoughts:

How does the inquisitor unit get about, do they need a transport like a chimera?

I'd add at least one or two crusaders for storm shields and something to benefit from the Jokaero's upgrade power e.g. warriors with melta/plasma guns.

Drop the psilencer and psybolts from the purifier squad and add a hammer and a sixth man with halberd

The banner and psybolts aren't really worth it on a 5 man terminator squad

The falchions and halberds aren't worth it on the strike squad, save the points for the intereceptor squad. Psycannons on this unit are a must.

The interceptor squad should be larger, psybolts for rear armour shots could be good and psycannons are just plain better than psilencers.

[Duncndisorderly]

Some thoughts:

How does the inquisitor unit get about, do they need a transport like a chimera?

I'd add at least one or two crusaders for storm shields and something to benefit from the Jokaero's upgrade power e.g. warriors with melta/plasma guns.

Drop the psilencer and psybolts from the purifier squad and add a hammer and a sixth man with halberd

The banner and psybolts aren't really worth it on a 5 man terminator squad

The falchions and halberds aren't worth it on the strike squad, save the points for the intereceptor squad. Psycannons on this unit are a must.

The interceptor squad should be larger, psybolts for rear armour shots could be good and psycannons are just plain better than psilencers.

Transpor for the inquisitor,Doh, told you Im inept :eek:
thanks for the info buddy, im gonna revisit this list immediately

[Duncndisorderly]

Have made a few adjustments and now have 155pts left to play with, although i do need to add some extra beef to the interceptors, what else could /should i be spending this on??

HQ

brotherhood champion

Elite

6 man Purifiers squad + incinerator, 3x halberd 1 hammer
Razorback with psybolt ammo for purifeirs

Troops

5 man terminator squad + psicannon, psibolts, 2 x facions and 1 halberd

10 man strike squad + 3 x facions, 3 x halberd, 1 hammer, 2 x psicannon, psibolts
Rhino for strike squad

fast

5 man interceptor + psybolts

Heavy

Dreadknight with Gat psilencer and psicannon

Dreadknight with Gat psilencer and incinerator
__________________

[Unzuul the Lascivious]

Psybolts are good, they cause plenty of injuries which equals more saves for your opponent to make. Personally, I don't like Terminator squads with mixed weapons - having them all with Halberds for an I6 charge is far better. I would keep the banner in, the extra attacks are nice, especially if you get charged by a knarly unit like Khorne Berserkers.
Drop the hammer in the Purifiers - they aren't going to be going after vehicles, or shouldn't be - they're for bog standard troop offing.
I have no arguments with your strike squad, but are the 3 extra attacks from the Falchions worth it? Better your attacks hit first I think. Halberds are just weapon of choice for me, I guess it's attacks over Initiative. The Hammer can be useful for bashing big guys I guess.
Interceptors could use a bit more love - the Psybolts are good, but an Incinerator would be sweet as here.

Gatling psilencers seem like a good idea, but they are actually pony against anything with a T4 and power armour upwards. I'd stick with the Incinerators and Psycannons - if you can spare the points, a Greatsword is awesome. Daemonhammers on Dreadknights are just not worth it at all.

[Bean]

HQ

inquisitor in termie armour and retinue = 1 x jokaero, 1 x msytic and 1 x flagellant


This unit is hopelessly conflicted. You have a guy in Terminator Armor who's only good in close combat (and not exactly spectacular, there). You have one fragile guy with a big gun, one fragile guy who helps you with deepstriking, and one guy who's fragile and only good when charging. And no transport. All this unit does is get in its own way while wasting points.

Playing an Inquisitor and a Retinue is fine, but if you're going to go that way, first decide what you want it to do. Want it to shoot? Drop the Termie armour and give it a hell-rifle. Cut the Flagellant, add another Jokaero and a pair of heavy bolter servitors and stick it in a Chimaera. That's an acceptable shooty squad.

Want it to charge? Cut the Jokaero and Mystic. Bulk up the squad with Death Cult Assassins and Crusaders, then put them in a Crusader (land raider) or a Storm Raven.

Pick something and go with it. Don't waste points by half-assing a squad.




Elite

5 man Purifiers + incinerator, psilencer and 2 x halberd and psybolts
Razorback with psybolt ammo for purifeirs


Psylencers are terrible and Psybolts are a waste on three storm-bolters. Either play two psycannons or two incinerators (but, really, play two psycannons).



Troops

5 man terminator squad + banner, psicannon, psibolts, 2 x facions and 1 halberd

10 man strike squad + 3 x facions, 3 x halberd, 1 hammer, psilencer, psibolts, incinerator
Rhino for strike squad


Again, psylencers are terrible. Banners aren't really worth it on Terminators. Close combat upgrades are dubious on the Strike Squad, given how expensive they are. Again, Psycannons are a better call than Incinerators.



fast

5 man interceptor + stave, halberd, 2 x hammer and a psilencer


Staff is overpriced in this squad. Psilencers, again, are terrible.



Heavy

Dreadknight with Gat psilencer and psicannon

Dreadknight with Gat psilencer and incinerator


Psylencers are still terrible. The incinerator is alright. Consider teleporters.


Well. You weren't joking--this is probably the single worst Grey Knight list I've seen yet. You can revamp this into something playable, but all you retain is the general outline. My suggestion is to try this list:

40 : Ordo Malleus Inquisitor, Hellrifle
90 : Henchmen Warband: 2 Jokaero, 2 Servitors (heavy bolters or multi-meltas)
55 : Chimaera (Multi-laser, Heavy Bolter)

260 : Purifier Squad (10) 4x Incinerator, 5x Halberd, 1x McHammer
40 : Rhino

230 : Terminators, Psycannon (5), 3x Halberds, 1x Sword, 1x McHammer,

235 : Grey Knight Strike Squad (10), 2x Psycannons, 1x McHammer
40 : Rhino

280 : Interceptor Squad (10) 2x Psycannon

205 : Dreadknight, Personal Teleporter

1475

You can use your last 25 points to buy some extra upgrades wherever you want. Psybolts on the Interceptors isn't a bad idea, or a Sword on the Dreadknight. A couple of Falchions here or there if you want.

This, at least, would be close to a reasonable list.

Also, you can drop half those purifiers and half the interceptors to add in another dreadknight, but stick to close-combat dreadknights (teleporter, maybe sword).

[Duncndisorderly]

Well. You weren't joking--this is probably the single worst Grey Knight list I've seen yet.

:D told ya so, seriously i tried that list last night against a mate's imperials fists and only narrowly avoided being tabled so believe me when I say , im gonna take your advice on board and revamp this list whole sale, thanks for the helps people and if anybody else has a tuppence of advice they feel like throwing my way it would be apprciated.

[Bean]

:D told ya so, seriously i tried that list last night against a mate's imperials fists and only narrowly avoided being tabled so believe me when I say , im gonna take your advice on board and revamp this list whole sale, thanks for the helps people and if anybody else has a tuppence of advice they feel like throwing my way it would be apprciated.

Hey, sorry to hear you got tabled (but it's not exactly a surprise =P). I hope your next game goes better for you and you get some mileage out of this advice. Good luck!

[Duncndisorderly]

So i took some advice and rewrote the list as follows

HQ brotherhood Champion

Elite
10 man purifier squad =2 x incinerator,2 x psycannon, 4 x halberd, 2 x hammer

Troop
10 man strike squad = 2 x Psycannon 4 x halberd, 2 x Hammer, 2 x sword , Psybolts
2 x rhino with psybolts

5 man terminator squad = Psicannon , 1 x Mc Hammer,3 x Halberd

Fast
10 man interceptor squad = 1 x Psycannon,1 x incinerator, 4 x halberd, 2x hammer, 2x sword

Heavy
Dreadknight = Psicannon + Incinerator

Im still toying with the idea of trimming one rhino and a few purifiers to afford a teleport for the dreadknight

[Bean]

This seems better, but there are a few things to consider:

First, can a Strike Squad bring two Rhinos? Is one of those a dedicated transport for the Purifiers?

Second: where does the Brotherhood Champion go? He doesn't fit in with either of the power-armor squads in their transports, which means he's probably just attaching to the terminators and foot-slogging. This is fine, but it seems a little odd.

Third: I think you'll be happier without mixed weapons, unless you're pretty much always planning to combat-squad your units to put the incinerator in one half and the psycannon in the other. If you're not, consider putting all the incinerators in one unit and all the psycannons in the other. You'll likely get more mileage out of both, that way.

Fourth: don't drop a rhino--both your Purifiers and Strike Squad should have a wheelbox. It's definitely worth 40 points (or even 45, though I'm not entirely sold on psybolts, here--with or without them, the Rhino's shots are marginal).

Fifth, I still don't like the shooty Dreadknight, but at least this one's running heavy psycannon instead of the psilencer.

Sixth, I still think you're spending too many points on power-armor halberds, but that's a small tweak and I imagine you'll figure out just the right number on your own. Just consider: for less than the cost of the eight halberds in the Strike and Interceptor Squads, you could put a teleporter on that dreadknight. Also, make sure the hammers go on your Justicars--that's the weapon where you want that extra swing.

[isotope99]

My views:

Keep the rhinos one for the purifiers, one for the strike. Psybolts feel like a waste of points on a Rhino to me.

Recommend dropping the incinerators from the purifiers (or upgrading to psycannons), their cleansing flame will deal with hordes in CC pretty reliably and you could end up cheating yourself out of the charge if your opponent is smart with casualty removal (I've rarely fired my incinerators in my games beacause of this).

Personally, I don't rate the champion and would try and scrape together enough points for a librarian or GM, but it's a matter of personal preference)

The psybolts will probably do more good on the intereceptor squad as the strike squad is probably going to spend a decent amount of time in their rhino, firing their psycanons from the hatch.

Agree with bean about special CC weapons being way overpriced for units with only 1A, so could shave some points here.

I'd stick with either guns on the dreadknight or the teleporter. Both is going to make the model outrageously expensive and its already going to be a fire magnet. You could buy two bare dreadknights for the price of one tooled up one.

[Duncndisorderly]

Again, many thanks for the help people, much appreciated. Im making a third revision to this list nowand im considering throwing an inquisitior and retinue in as an alternative to brotherhood champion, 5 interceptors and the psybolts on the rhinos, gotta run the numbers first but i should be able to afford an Inquistor with hellrifle, 2 jokaero and 3 servitors with multi melta/hvy bolters. i figure it may give me more anti tank but im not sure if i need a transport for this and if so does it have to be a chimera?

[isotope99]

For a defensive tank, the chimera is probably better. More fire points and better front armour (plus the multi laser and H bolter to add to your shooting.

[Duncndisorderly]

Ok mkIII it is then

HQ

Inquisitor with hell riflle

Elite

Inquisitors retinue = 2 x Jokaero, 3 x Servitor (2 multi melta, 1 Hvy Bolter)1 mystic, Chimera


10 man purifier squad =2 x incinerator,2 x psycannon, 4 x halberd, 2 x hammer

Troop
10 man strike squad = 2 x Psycannon 4 x halberd, 2 x Hammer, 2 x sword , Psybolts
2 x rhino with psybolts

5 man terminator squad = Psicannon , 1 x Mc Hammer,3 x Halberd

Fast
5man interceptor squad = 1 x incinerator, 2 x halberd, 2x hammer

Heavy
Dreadknight = Psicannon + Incinerator

If my maths is good I've got 55pts left
which means 2 extra psycannons for the purifiers instead of the incinerators and 15pts of spare change

[jorz192]

I would drop the psybolts from the rhinos and the four force halbreds from the strike squad.

The dreadknight gets a heavy psycannon which is even better than a normal one.

I wouldn't put four psycannons on the purifiers I would stay with two. They can only fire two from the top hatches and they are more of a counter-attack unit.

With those changes you have 85 extra points. Dropping the psycannon from the terminators might be a good idea possibly exchanging it with psyammo to benefit the whole squad.

The incinerators aren't a good idea on the purifiers.

You can use the extra points to add psy ammo to the purifiers and add bodies to the interceptors, psyammo, and possibly a psycannon.

[DarkLink]

Actually, the heavy psycannon kinda sucks. Four guaranteed shots is much better than one large blast most of the time, and it's vastly better against vehicles. GKs are already good at killing infantry, it's the tanks you need to worry about. Thus, heavy psycannons are worse than normal psycannons against pretty much everything but maybe 'nidz and orks (which GKs are good against anyways).

Edit: I agree with jorz on the Purifiers. Only 2 psycannons, and Nemesis Weapons on the rest. Too many guns in the unit significantly limits their CC power, with not as much benefit as you'd think.

[Duncndisorderly]

So i play tested over the weekend and have made some modifications to this list which now reads as follows

HQ

Brother Captain with 3 servo skulls + Mc Demon Hammer

Elite

Vindicare Assasin

10 man purifier = 4 halberd, 2 hammer, 2 psycannon, 2 sword and a Rhino

Troop

10 man strike squad = halberd, 2 hammer, 2 psycannon, 2 sword and a Rhino

5 man terminator squad = 1 psycannon, 1 hammer and 3 halberd

Hvy

Dreadknight = Psycannon

Dreadnought = assault cannon, auto cannon and psybolts

My plan is relatively straight forward, use the servo skulls to assist in deepstriking the terminators with the brother captain, then use psychic communion to assist the deepstriking dreadknight. Meanwhile run the rhinos round as mobile platforms for the 2 psycannons along with the dreadnought and keep the assasin in cover as a tank popper .

[Duncndisorderly]

As a final addition to this thread I play tested the new list last night and completely destroyed my Brother Imperial Fists. Annihilation game 8 - 3.
The vindicare popped his landraider first turn which meant Lysander and his buddies had to walk the board and my dread destroyed his thunderfire cannon turn 1 also. Had the game not ended turn 5 he would probably have been tabled
Thanks for the help people, much appreciated