Switch to resin: Good or bad for Specialist Games

[eldargal]

In the discussions about the rumoured switch to resin on Warseer, quite a number of people expressed the opinion it would signal the end for the Specialist Games range*. Now I thought this was absurd, I think it may have the opposite effect

-Instead of having to produce and maintain a stock of low selling models in expensive metal, GW can do it in much, much cheaper resin.

-The same moulds can be used with some alterations (extra vents apparently) so the costs of adaptation are minimal.

So the way I see it GW can maintain a stock of SG figures in their stores for much less than they can currently, why would they suddenly scrap Specialist Games?

What do to think? Is there something I'm missing, or are their worries unfounded?



*To the point they had started buying up metal miniatures to stockpile for the End Times.:rolleyes:

[DrLove42]

With cheaper models and a free rule book they might open up more business.

I don't know the sales figures for SG obviously but I think they might pick up. With cheaper models i might even have a look at Gothic...

but they won't ever stock them in stores, only on order. They just don't have the power needed to be on a store shelf, even with a lower cost. Short of new boxes, sets and a big re-release into stores from GW, I don't think they'll ver see the Highstreet

[Lerra]

It will cost GW less money, but that doesn't mean that prices will be dropping. Has GW ever dropped prices on a blister? I've only seen them go up :rolleyes:

[eldargal]

Hm I mean't to keep them in stock, not stores, not sure why I said that.:rolleyes:

Oh I don't think the retail price will go down, but cost of manufacture for GW will drop significantly so it makes more sense to encourage people to buy them when your profit margins are higher. Why show off the SG range in White Dwarf, for example, when you could show off something that will make you more money.

[MaltonNecromancer]

I'm not sure if it's the end or not for SG. It's not like the (usually early 90's ugly, often large handedly goofy looking, definitely overpriced) Specialist Games miniatures are normally worth getting, sad to say. I generally scratch build my own Epic stuff nowadays, and as for Necromunda, for the insane GW costs, frankly I would much prefer to spend that kind of money on other companies' lines (like Infinity or Malifaux).

Blood Bowl is the only game left out of the Specialist Games I like, and you can make a team from the huge line of Warhammer Fantasy stuff that looks better and is more personal than any of the official miniatures.

Ultimately, despite everything I've just said, I'd love to see cheap resin models forthe Specialist Games, but all I can see it being is another excuse to hike the prices by another 25%.

[Lerra]

The Inquisitor specialist models still look really cool:

http://www.games-workshop.com/gws/catalog/productDetail.jsp?prodId=prod1110218&rootCatGameStyle=
http://www.games-workshop.com/gws/catalog/productDetail.jsp?prodId=prod1110199
http://www.games-workshop.com/gws/catalog/productDetail.jsp?catId=&prodId=prod1110197
http://www.games-workshop.com/gws/catalog/productDetail.jsp?prodId=prod1110210

I've been meaning to buy the Inquisitor Kroot to make a Master Shaper for a while now. I'd much prefer him in resin so that the conversion is easier, so I think I'll take my chances.

You know, I think there are more named female models in the Inquisitor model line than in the 40k line . . .

[fuzzbuket]

The Inquisitor specialist models still look really cool:

http://www.games-workshop.com/gws/catalog/productDetail.jsp?prodId=prod1110218&rootCatGameStyle=
http://www.games-workshop.com/gws/catalog/productDetail.jsp?prodId=prod1110199
http://www.games-workshop.com/gws/catalog/productDetail.jsp?catId=&prodId=prod1110197
http://www.games-workshop.com/gws/catalog/productDetail.jsp?prodId=prod1110210

I've been meaning to buy the Inquisitor Kroot to make a Master Shaper for a while now. I'd much prefer him in resin so that the conversion is easier, so I think I'll take my chances.

You know, I think there are more named female models in the Inquisitor model line than in the 40k line . . .


ya know the =][= model are like 3x the size of normal WH40k!

but ill see how this pans out, ive been thinking of purchaseing soem epic to make a epic (lol) diorama!
the time to buy is nigh?

[Grailkeeper]

I certainly hope they don't, I agree with M.Necromancer on bloodbowl. Those miniatures are OLD. I have an official orc team but it looks terrible, I converted a much better looking one out of 40k Orks

[eldargal]

The Inquisitor models make excellent statues for 40k terrain, they really are beautiful. I lavished many, many hours painting up all the women and a bunch of the others just for fun too.

The Inquisitor, BFG, Mordheim and Necromunda ranges are all quite good, certainly worth saving. The rest, well it would be a shame to lose them on principle but they could certainly do with updates (which is very unlikely).

[MaltonNecromancer]

they could certainly do with updates (which is very unlikely)

That's the thing, really isn't it? In my dreams, GW release a new plastic Epic-scale sprue of IG tanks and AdMech Titans... *sigh* But no, for some reason, it's not ever going to happen. I'm going to have to put up with stupid 40K scale Titans instead. :mad:

Inquisitor models were always half and half for me. The Artemis one was good, and a couple of the others were okay... but Gary Morley? Seriously GW? After Nagash, NAGASH, you still give this goof work? Why not employ a monkey instead? At least a monkey has opposable thumbs. And what's that you say? He's produced another couple of turkeys? Well you've only yourself to blame.

Like I say, there were some great Inquisitor models, but a lot of them sucked the farts from a dead duck's rectum.

[Warpath]

If resin is much much cheaper then, i would love to see a dopr in GWs prices, but thats HIGHLY unlikely (see: impossible). I bet they will raise them again.

On another subject, i wonder if resin would be a better material for doing conversions or removing parts and stuff, its clearly softer than metal but also it's more rigid than plastic. I don't have much experience with resin, just own a couple of Forgeworld models, so this is just an idea.

[Astral Platypus]

You would think that a reduction of materials cost does not necessarily equal decrease in retail cost. I can't imagine us getting cheaper minis; that would mean someone who produces goods on a global scale has a soul.

Also, does anyone know how hazardous resin is as opposed to pewter or other soft metals?
(the above question is intended to be neither rhetorical or sarcastic)

[Skragger]

lso, does anyone know how hazardous resin is as opposed to pewter or other soft metals?
(the above question is intended to be neither rhetorical or sarcastic)

As far as I know, resin isn't too toxic, but I am not too of a well informed source. Using GWs old mantra "do it in a well ventilated area". My understanding is doing one or two models isn't too bad. If you're going to be doing something larger like a tank or a skwad of ladz you may want to do it outside (ha.. we lose up here on that one) or with a mask on.

"Okay everyone! Masks on, its hobbying time!"

[MaltonNecromancer]

resin isn't too toxic

It's very carcinogenic if you get it into your lungs, like if you're say, sanding it down (or otherwise reducing it to particulate by scraping off mold lines, etc...), so it does call for a little more maturity than pewter (which was, lest we forget, changed from lead for toxicity reasons, and lead's not anywhere near as dangerous as resin dust.)

[eldargal]

It depends on the resin apparently, some aren't particularly bad.

[chromedog]

Yep.

There is more than one kind of resin.
There are acrylic, polyurethane, polymeric and epoxy resins to start with.

A few of the acrylic resins use MEK as the catalyst. Methyl Ethyl Ketone is known as a carcinogen (and is rather volatile, too).
The Polyurethane resins are much safer by comparison.

It's kinda like saying that the current white metal alloy GW use is less toxic than the old pewter one.
While the lead has been removed, it was replaced with bismuth - which is still toxic.
And the Antimony in it is also toxic.

Not AS toxic, but still not safe to ingest.

[Lane]

Not to derail the conversation but the local GW store manager Just got back from their meeting in Memphis,TN including a tour of the production facilities and he said:

There was no sign of a switch in materials for individual minis.

The blisters that have been pulled from the shelves will be available by direct order.

There are very cool things coming but he can not talk about, not even hints, because he likes his job.

[Lockark]

My understanding of why resin was toxic was because when sanded the dust is razor sharp, and when inhaled it is cutting up the inside of lungs.

[Lane]

not quite

Resin dust can act like asbestos and silica in the lungs. They can get trapped in the lings and are not absorbed by the body. Over time the body forms scar tissue to encapsulate the irritating dust which in turn reduces lung capacity.

[faolan]

Remember that half the metals thrown into the pig's mix that is "White Metal" (which, sorry guys, ain't pewter) is rather toxic and/or hazardous.

As a matter of course, most any foreign substance, when introduced to the lungs, is pretty bad.

Most model resins aren't really cheaper than white metal alloys are. Add in the fact that FW (the part of GW that has experience with resins) ends up putting on sprue chunks that're bigger than the actual model most of the time, and their wastage will just go up, causing them to raise prices. Again.

I prefer resin personally, and dislike metal, but having said that - if you have a crap batch of metals come out of the moulds, you can melt it and repour it. You cannot do that with resins.

[Lerra]

Huh. I'm surprised that all of those blisters are going to Direct Order only. There were a lot of new minis on that list, like The Changeling and Lelith.

[Grailkeeper]

Actually Specialist games modesl tend to need more converting than normal models. 1. because there is a more limited range and 2. because they tend to be involved in long wysiwyg campaigns and gain extra weapons, equipment, scars and trophies.

Is Resin harder to convert than metal? I have never worked with it.I've heard its easy to bend, but I'm also afraid of cancer.

[eldargal]

Resin is easier, rather like plastic. Resin Necromunda gangers would certainly be a boon, my group has givne up on WYSIWYG for Necromunda simply because the of the effort involved.

[Denzark]

I like the Necromunda minis Malton