Imperium hypocrisy

[Brotherjames]

Maybe I don't know my fluff but the Relictors are excommunicate traitorous for using daemon weapons and the new GK codex is full of them just my opinion.

[Grailkeeper]

Imperial Hypocracy- haven't even begun to scratch the surface.

[Kawauso]

The Imperium does hypocritical things all the time - just like real governments, organizations and people. :P

They abhor psykers, but must employ them for the Imperium to survive (astropaths, navigators). Also there's, you know, the Emperor.

They preach not to communicate with or trust aliens, but they employ races like the Jokaero and parley with the likes of the Eldar and Tau all the time when it's in their best interest. Some inquisitors even employ alien technology in their campaigns against xenos.

They loathe mutants but the IG is full of the likes of Ogryn and Ratlings.

The list goes on.

Also, the Grey Knights are a secretive chapter that few people know much about.

[Fellend]

I think it falls under the category of "If you can handle it, then go ahead, just don't do it where people can see it"
There's nothing wrong with using the enemies weapons against them. It's just wrong to make the masses believe that they can do it, because eventually they will be corrupted. And we all know that the people who decides who are corrupted can't possibly be corrupted themselves...

[Skragger]

I think it falls under the category of "If you can handle it, then go ahead, just don't do it where people can see it"
There's nothing wrong with using the enemies weapons against them. It's just wrong to make the masses believe that they can do it, because eventually they will be corrupted. And we all know that the people who decides who are corrupted can't possibly be corrupted themselves...

I dread the day they start using our Assault 1 Rokkit Launcha's against us. :eek:

[chromedog]

Imperial Hypocracy- haven't even begun to scratch the surface.

THIS.

The Imperium is one of "Do as we say, not as we do.".
They are a bigger and worse version of your parents.
It is founded on hypocrisy. The Emperor did not wish to be worshipped as a god - he had hoped humanity had grown beyond the need for such superstitions.
Yet here he is, worshipped as a god by those he set up to keep his empire going.

They despise psykers as "witches" but MUST use them to keep their pathetic empire from crumbling (both the astropaths and the mutant freaks that are the Navigators).

They despise the mutant, but "beneficial" mutants are fine. Tentacles=bad.

Jokaero aren't technically considered Xenos - they are not considered to be sentient, and not a coherent threat. Aliens, yes, but useful ones.

Last DH codex had Daemonhunters with Daemonhosts - the creation of which will get you killed as a heretic (if caught). Daemonweapons are fine if they are 'reconsecrated' (Calgar's HULKSMASH fists).

[Corvus-Master-of-The-4th]

(SPOILER ALERT) Well, before the new codex Grey Knights didn't use Daemon Weapons (¬_¬). But it's all changed now hasn't it :L? But taking the new fluff, and fluff from Hammer of Daemons by Ben Counter, Grey Knights simply can't be corrupted in any possible way and so they are completly "safe" to use such items (I.E Justicar Alaric had a Collar of Khorne forced on him, he was possessed by a Daemon (who he eventually overcame with the help of Deldar Mandrake [don't ask :L]) and was trapped on a Daemon world... So yeah they can't be corrupted pritty much. BUT I believe the use of Daemon weapons with an Inquisitor is designed to show radical Inquisitors, the same for the Jokaero and of course Daemon hosts. The best way of looking at the fluff is to combine fluff from last edition of Daemon Hunters, and the new Grey Knights... Just my theories :D

[MaltonNecromancer]

the Relictors are excommunicate traitorous for using daemon weapons and the new GK codex is full of them just my opinion.

"If the President does it, it isn't a crime."

The Imperium is a fascist, theocratic police state, governed by petty, vicious humans. Who is surprised that they are hypocrites? Seriously, not one Imperial faction could remotely be considered heroic. Yes, certain individuals could, undoubtedly, but by way of a very brief example, consider the way the (supposedly "goody") chapters conduct themselves:

Ultramarines: keep the peace in their sector through overwhelming application of violence; Ultramar is clearly a dictatorship under the control of Marneus Calgar. Compare the way that someone like Kim Jong Il is lionised in his own country, and you can clearly see the parallels: just 'cause the codex says they're great doesn't make it so, because the codex is deliberately written as Imperial propaganda.

Space Wolves: yeah, because Wolf-riding berserkers are going to be really good at economics and the business of running a democracy. Feudal Darwinian madness with lightsabers does not a happy planet make. "Peaceful" (i.e,: consumed by tribal-level but not planet destroying warfare), certainly, but not nice.

Grey Knights: who will cheerfully slaughter babies and children if they've so much as seen a daemon because "It's the only way to be sure; also, it's just a hundred humans - they're no more special or important than anyone else". Hmmm, sure thing Mr. Monomaniac. Nice to know we've tried to find a way other than embracing an all-consuming, zero-sum game nihilism.

Hypocrisy is the least awful thing the Imperium does. It's largely due to the fact the Inquisiton itself can't quite agree on the tenets of the Imperial Faith. Consider standard Inquisitors as Fundamentalist Catholics and Radicals as Fundamentalist Protestants; they agree that The Emperor is a divine being, but they disagree on everything else, and as might makes right in 40K, there's a lot of wars about it.

Gotta love 40K for it's deep, deep satire of religion as a concept.

[Wildeybeast]

(SPOILER ALERT) Well, before the new codex Grey Knights didn't use Daemon Weapons (¬_¬). But it's all changed now hasn't it :L? But taking the new fluff, and fluff from Hammer of Daemons by Ben Counter, Grey Knights simply can't be corrupted in any possible way and so they are completly "safe" to use such items (I.E Justicar Alaric had a Collar of Khorne forced on him, he was possessed by a Daemon (who he eventually overcame with the help of Deldar Mandrake [don't ask :L]) and was trapped on a Daemon world... So yeah they can't be corrupted pritty much. BUT I believe the use of Daemon weapons with an Inquisitor is designed to show radical Inquisitors, the same for the Jokaero and of course Daemon hosts. The best way of looking at the fluff is to combine fluff from last edition of Daemon Hunters, and the new Grey Knights... Just my theories :D

Not sure I buy this. What makes the Grey Knights so incorruptible when Fulgrim picked up one and got turned into its pet within about 5 minutes? Surely it's only strength of character, in which case no one is incorruptible.

[Xas]

grey kngihts dont use deamon weapons. they use xeno tech and sorcery but not deamon weapons.
its the radical inquisitors who use those (and some special grey knight who carriers one around cause the battlefield is supposedly the most save place to store the weapon but he doesnt draw on its deamonic powers).

[Corvus-Master-of-The-4th]

Not sure I buy this. What makes the Grey Knights so incorruptible when Fulgrim picked up one and got turned into its pet within about 5 minutes? Surely it's only strength of character, in which case no one is incorruptible.

Problem is, Fulgrim had no idea what Chaos is and had no chance as soon as he touched the blades handle... It gave him what he wanted. The diffrence is Grey Knights are all Psykers (some of the most capable in exsistance), and secondly they are completly incorruptible they have Defences in their armour, in their flesh, in their mind, they're is nothing that Chaos can do to corrupt them, that's always been the fluff (and I hope shall never ever change D: ) + They proably have a stronger will than even the early Primarchs (mainly because they understand they need to have a strong will) with Knowledge comes power

[MaltonNecromancer]

they are completly incorruptible they have Defences in their armour, in their flesh, in their mind, they're is nothing that Chaos can do to corrupt them, that's always been the fluff (and I hope shall never ever change D: ) + They proably have a stronger will than even the early Primarchs (mainly because they understand they need to have a strong will) with Knowledge comes power

Until a Black Library story requires otherwise.Good stories trump absolutist fluff every time.

Plus, GK are still (despite their claims and hopes) human. And who ever heard of an infallible human? Detective Lester Freamon perhaps, Dwayne "The Rock" Johnson at a pinch, but that's it.

[wittdooley]

Until a Black Library story requires otherwise.Good stories trump absolutist fluff every time.

Plus, GK are still (despite their claims and hopes) human. And who ever heard of an infallible human? Detective Lester Freamon perhaps, Dwayne "The Rock" Johnson at a pinch, but that's it.

Let's also not forget that it wasn't a five-minute corruption of Fulgrim. It was over a looooong period of time, and he had no idea it was happening. His fall to Chaos was really tragic because of that.

It's like that tiny drop of poison in your coffee every morning. You don't notice any effects until that straw final breaks the back and kills you.

[Corvus-Master-of-The-4th]

Until a Black Library story requires otherwise.Good stories trump absolutist fluff every time.

Plus, GK are still (despite their claims and hopes) human. And who ever heard of an infallible human? Detective Lester Freamon perhaps, Dwayne "The Rock" Johnson at a pinch, but that's it.

Yeah good points... But I love the character that is Justicar Alaric and believe he is on the same lavel as Dwayne Johnson... If possible?

[DrLove42]

It's like that tiny drop of poison in your coffee every morning. You don't notice any effects until that straw final breaks the back and kills you.

I know what you mean with this, but will point out a tiny drop each morning will just build up an immunity to it.

I remember a famous ancient greek leader who was so paranoid of being poisoned he consumed tiny bits of poison every day to build up his immunity (in 40k Duke Sliscus of the DE also does this). In the ancient greek's case when his city was overthrown by the Romans he tried to kill himself....but his "suicide capsule" of poison didn't work. So he had to stab himself repeatedly to get the job done....

[Gotthammer]

Mithridates of Pontus, though depending on accounts he either asked a friend to kill him or tried to stab himself but was too weak to do it properly, so was finished off by his enemies.

[MaltonNecromancer]

I know what you mean with this, but will point out a tiny drop each morning will just build up an immunity to it.

Captain Pedant To The Rescue! This is not entirely true; it's actually a time-honored storytelling trope with some basis in fact, but more basis in The Rule Of Cool. In real life, whether you can do it or not depends upon the poisons, 'cause there's lots of different types, and they all interact with the body in different ways. Some of them, yes, building up an immunity is possible. Some of them, no - try to build the immunity, and instead, you eventually build up a toxic level of poison and die.

http://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pmwiki.php/Main/AcquiredPoisonImmunity

And, much as I hate to quote The Darwin Awards...

http://www.darwinawards.com/darwin/darwin2007-18.html

[mysterex]

Yeah I noticed how the Codex went from if you take daemonhosts you can't take grey knights to if you want daemonhosts you must take grey knights.

This comes about because inquisitorial retinues don't take a force organisation slot which means you have to use grey knights to fill your two troop slots.