Bikers-Marine or Ravenwing

[Vexxnoir]

Hello was lloking back at my old dark angels models now that the new faq is out and i have time to play. Was considering doing a biker army and maybe deathwing[different post]. Came up with the following for a try at bikers at 1750 points. Below i wrote what i came up with for both ravenwing and for normal marines codexs Also have a few questions.
1-First which works better ravenwing or normal marines? Raven is all scouts and fearless but has smaller numbers/unit sizes.
2- If i go with ravenwing do i use sammeal on his jetbike or on his landspeeder?
3-Would it be good to add a drop pod with a squad of tactical marines or a dreadnought in the normal marines to drop on turn one?

Ravenwing
HQ
Sammeal-205
Libarian on bike-150

TROOPS
Ravenwing attack squadron --420 points
---6 Bikers, Multimelta attack bike, and landspeeder with heavy bolter/assualt cannon
---1 meltagun, 1 plasmagun, Power fist for sergant

Ravenwing attack squadron --320 points
---6 Bikers, Multimelta attack bike
---1 meltagun, 1 plasmagun, Power fist for sergant

2 x Ravenwing attack squadron [215 each]---430 points
---3 Bikers and Multimelta attack bike
---1 flamer, 1 plasmagun, Power fist for sergant

FAST ATTACK
Raven wing support landspeeder with multimelta and typoon missle launcher--75 points
Raven wing support landspeeder with multimelta and typoon missle launcher--75 points
Raven wing support landspeeder with multimelta and typoon missle launcher--75 points
Total -1750

OR

Normal Marines

HQ
Captain on bike with relic blade and storm shield--180 points
Libarian on bike-135 points

TROOPS
2 x Bike squad [315 points each]--630 points
---8 bikers and multimelta attack bike
---meltagun, plasma gun, power fist for sergant

1 x Bike squad ---180 points
---4 bikers and heavy bolter attack bike
---2 flamers and power sword for sergant

FAST ATTACK
Land speeder squadron-180 points
---2 land speeders with heavy bolter and typoon missle launcher

Land speeder squadron-180 points
---2 land speeders with heavy bolter and typoon missle launcher

Scout bike squadron--265
--10 bikers
--3 astartes gernade launchers and power fist for sergant

Total =1750 points

Plase c&c any help/comments welcome.
Thanx
Vexx

[eagleboy7259]

If you're using Ravenwing it is usually better to take Sammy in a Land Speeder. A fast AV 14 tank that has twin-linked assault cannon can usually do some damage. Plasma Cannons are pretty meh, so having one that simply scatters less isn't really all that great. He's a very mediorce assault character with a very mediorce stat line in the jetbike.

Ravenwing suffer badly from the current fearless rules. They aren't great in assault, since they have the basic marine stat line and can only take a power weapon / fist on the sergeant. Scoring Land Speeders sounds great until you realize its a scoring 100pt AV 10 open topped skimmer. Oh with an assault cannon and a heavy bolter so you'll be flying into small arms range. Yep he's probably not surviving the game.

Chapter Tactics is probably the best thing that you can have on bikes. It's so good, it might even be worth not taking Khan just to keep your Chapter Tactics. A Vanillia SM Commander on bike will be the hardest hitting bike character you can take in 40k, Relic Blade, Storm Shield, Artificer Armor and Bike. Your SM Biker Command Squad will be the hardest hitting unit in your army, simular to a squad of terminators. Your Commander will be buffed out to be T5, 2+/3++ FNP. Other bike units are basically mobile melta or relentless plasma.

Scouts work well with this kind of build, so do Scout Bikers, Assault Marines and all the rather obvious stuff. Drop Dreads can really help out or just Drop Pod Tactical or Assault Marines.

[blackarmchair]

I love bikes; love 'em. That being said, I do not think bike armies are viable in WH40k in general.

GW seems to think that anything that moves faster than jump infantry needs to cost an arm and a leg and biker troops are just not that durable. T5 is nice on paper but when you need to get close enough to use the melta/plasma you're carrying it just doesn't hold up to the inevitable counter-assault.

Attack Bike Squads are nice and the Captain Biker Deathstar unit works but that aside...biker troops are pretty bad.

In a just for fun game I'd say you have the right idea. In a competitive environment I'd say leave the bikes at home.

[L192837465]

The biggest problem that Ravenwing suffers from is it's only "meh" at shooting, and pretty poor in combat. It has no real redeeming qualities other than it's fast as crap. Which is why dual-wing armies are freaking sweet. You add the punch of terminators, and the list becomes 3x as good. I'd recommend giving that a try instead of an all biker force.

[dethangel]

im running a dwing list that has 6 bikes and 2attack bikes. i find that they are great for 3 things scout, teleport-homers(huge), and fast tank/transport busting. i equip them 3 bikes and 1 abike w/ 2meltas, 1 MM, mbombs 195pts and 3 bikes 1 abike w/ 2flamers(for hoard and shooty armies), multi-melta, pw, mbombs 200pts. what works for me is i race these guys across the field drop in some superterms 6THSS, CML +1A, F.N.P,baliel. theni use the bikes to crack the transports for the terms. then they pretty much die after that, but they do there job. they suck in assaults. well non vehical assaults anyway. for me they are disposable. i like them but against assault armies (ie BA,korn,DE etc) they dont stand a chance..