Dangerous Terrain checks and allocating wounds

[JMichael]

Reading the rules for Dangerous Terrain, it seems that you do not actually allocate wounds as you would for shooting, but instead roll one die for each model effected individually.

I have this running on another forum. Most in that thread feel that there is no would allocation, but always the more opinions the better!
As a key point, I generally do allow alllocating the wounds just liek shooting, except on multiple wound models.

Here are the key points

The rules state on p14:
Roll a d6 for every model...on a 1 the model suffers a wound with no armor or cover saves allowed (wounds and saves are explained in the next section).

I don't think that the 'wounds and saves are explained in the next section' = this is how they should be allocated. At that point in the rulebook, the reader would not even know what a wound or save is. Indeed under the section 'Complex Units' on p25 (where wound allocation for shooting is covered) it states, "once the number of wounds caused by the firing unit has been determined..."
It is specifically referring to shooting. Under Assaults, it specifies that wounds are allocate in the same manner as for shooting.

And on page20 under 'Taking Saving Throws': "it is common for units to include models with different weapons or wargear...we need to know exactly who has been wounded, and this requires an extra step in the shooting process."
Again specifically referring to shooting.

On that note, I do play rolling all like units together (same as shooting). Although I do this to speed up the game, not because I think it is how the rules are written.

It still seems pretty clear that each model rolls a dangerous terrain check individually. And this could in fact then cause a unit to be out of cohesion.

Since I don't believe there is any required wound allocation, you also can't put more than one wound on multiple wound models. I may be mistaken on the multiple wound model, but it makes sense. A large group of Nobs would instead take several single wounds instead of loosing several entire models!


I use Night Spinners a lot! And thus Dangerous terrain checks are forced upon my opponent often.

[somerandomdude]

You are correct, they are taken individually, and while most people won't have a problem with rolling all like models together, you should specify which exact model is being rolled for.

This matters most when assaulting through dangerous terrain. If I have a squad of 10, with seven of them being armed the same, and I roll them collectively, I could just take the wounds from the back to make sure I get more models into assault, but this is technically against the rules (although many people won't know it). What should happen is I roll for the front guy, then the next one, and on to the very last.

During regular movement this doesn't have as much of an effect because of the freedom allowed by the movement rules. It's still the correct way to do it, but it is time consuming and many friendly players will not force it outside of the assault phase. I run a 12 man Hellion squad with the Baron (reroll dangerous terrain for the unit) which means I have a lot of rolling to do each turn. If I had to roll (and reroll) for each model individually it would take a lot of time, despite being correct.

[justsam]

most of the people i play against would allow you to allocate following the wargear rules. one on the sarge, one on the flamer, one on the missile launcher, 7 on the bobos, removing accordingly

[Daemonette666]

most of the people i play against would allow you to allocate following the wargear rules. one on the sarge, one on the flamer, one on the missile launcher, 7 on the bobos, removing accordingly
I use this method, and use different coloured dice for the differently armed models.

As to the question of the multi-wound creatures, page 26 of the rule book covers this. So once all unsaved wounds for models that are armed and armoured the same are tallied, remove whole models before allocating wounds to the next model.

I would use the rules used for shooting, for the dangerous terrain test.

[Mr. Black]

Dangerous Terrain test are done on a per-model bases, so if your Power Fist and IC land in the terrain then you are individually checking for the IC and the Power Fist, these wounds are not allocated.

This can also cause cases where Multi-Wound units, such as Tyranid Shrikes, are running around with two models with one wound each; the removing whole models where possibly edict is only in regards to wound allocation, which is not entering this process.

Same as a brood of Zoanthropes taking Psychic Tests, only the individual model can Perils and take the wound, regardless of the condition of the rest of the unit.

[Culven]

The Assault Rules also show that Dangerous Terrain is intended to be done on a model-by-model basis, and in fact should be done as each model is moved. It is possible that an Assault could fail beacuse the only model in range failed its Dangerous Terrain test and was removed as a casualty. If the wounds could be allocated, then the player would be permitted to allocate the wound to another model which would not affect the outcome of the attemted Assault.

[somerandomdude]

Dangerous Terrain test are done on a per-model bases, so if your Power Fist and IC land in the terrain then you are individually checking for the IC and the Power Fist, these wounds are not allocated.

This can also cause cases where Multi-Wound units, such as Tyranid Shrikes, are running around with two models with one wound each; the removing whole models where possibly edict is only in regards to wound allocation, which is not entering this process.

Same as a brood of Zoanthropes taking Psychic Tests, only the individual model can Perils and take the wound, regardless of the condition of the rest of the unit.

I'm not sure if I would agree that it works that way:


Page 14 - Dangerous Terrain

On the roll of a 1, the model suffers a wound, with no armour or cover saves allowed (wounds and saves are explained in the next section).


Page 26 - Units of Multiple-wound Models AKA "the next section"

Once you have determined the number of unsaved wounds suffered by a group of identical multiple-wound models, you must remove whole models as casualties where possible.

Are DT wounds "suffered"? Yes.

The assault phase (specifically Page 39) says nothing about multiple-wound models, and actually do not tell you to refer to Page 26 when talkibg about saves and casualties (it tells you to refer to the shooting phase in the section about "allocating wounds", and allocation happens before removing models). Does this mean that Shrikes that suffer wounds can spread them out? No, the rules address multiple-wound models once (and only once) because that section contains all of the information needed to handle multiple-wound models.

That's the way I read it, at least.

[justsam]

without the rules in front of me, i'd point out that it specifically says "the model suffers a wound". there's a section in the beginning explaining the difference between model and unit in the rules.