Drop Pods Vs. TLOS

[Denzark]

Hey all.

I am about to start painting some drop pods. Now, I want to have them with doors sealed - I don't like the way they flippy-flappy all over the place, I can't be arsed to paint the insides and think they will be easier to transport.

Now I believe somewhere may have stated that no vehicle has to have its hatches medelled open. But, how does it effect TLOS, particualrlly if a big squad bails out - some might need to shoot through the open doors to target the enemy - or is this not allowed?

In which case they could cower behind it maybe 1st turn, to try and avoid en fire?

Also, with disembarking, most people I have seen stick the transported models in btb with the pod - do you not have 2" from the hull?

Cheers aye,

[Cryl]

You do get the 2" disembark - it's 2" from the hull though not 2" from the edge of the open door.

I normally do vehicles with the doors closed but for my pods I did open ones, it's not that tricky to paint the insides and the doors themselves stay closed pretty well until you want them open, it makes it a lot easier for gameplay too. If you did model with closed doors (and I'm sure most wouldn't have a problem playing that) then you'd just have to be clear with your opponent and agree how the pods can be shot through as if the doors were open

hope that helps

[Denzark]

The painting issue isn't ease - how hard is a coat of BGM followed by a black wash? :D I'm more worried about TLOS - ie yes you can see through the pod, but it isn't like seeing a target through say, a LR sponson - it is a direct line through the hull and I'm not sure this is allowed - could you shoot through the legs of a monstrous crerature for example?

[Lerra]

Here's a relevant bit from the GW Grand Tournament FAQ:

"Question 44) Drop pod footprint. A standard size would be nice and do they block LOS when they land, especially if you keep some petal doors up and some down?

The new Games Workshop drop pod model will be used for this. Use true line of sight for targeting purposes once the drop pod has descended.

It is perfectly reasonable to keep some of the petal doors up as the occupants receive up to date information on the situation on the ground as they descend, thus enabling them to deploy to their maximum advantage.

Please note that if the petals are up or down, this must be represented on the model.

If the petals are up, the drop pod is still open topped and the drop pod’s weapon cannot shoot as the petals block line of sight from the weapon. If you are using home drop pod, this last point still applies."

I use a scratch-built drop pod, and my doors don't open. So I play that the storm bolter never gets to fire as it never has LOS. In exchange, the drop pod is slightly better at blocking LOS. I haven't had any opponents complain really.

[Denzark]

Here's a relevant bit from the GW Grand Tournament FAQ:

"Question 44) Drop pod footprint. A standard size would be nice and do they block LOS when they land, especially if you keep some petal doors up and some down?

The new Games Workshop drop pod model will be used for this. Use true line of sight for targeting purposes once the drop pod has descended.

It is perfectly reasonable to keep some of the petal doors up as the occupants receive up to date information on the situation on the ground as they descend, thus enabling them to deploy to their maximum advantage.

Please note that if the petals are up or down, this must be represented on the model.

If the petals are up, the drop pod is still open topped and the drop pod’s weapon cannot shoot as the petals block line of sight from the weapon. If you are using home drop pod, this last point still applies."

I use a scratch-built drop pod, and my doors don't open. So I play that the storm bolter never gets to fire as it never has LOS. In exchange, the drop pod is slightly better at blocking LOS. I haven't had any opponents complain really.

Thanks lerra, have you got a link to that FAQ?

[tongalad]

How do your occupants disembark if your doors don't open? If you play that the SB cannot fire as the doors are shut...then you have surely to play the occupants never get out?

[Culven]

How do your occupants disembark if your doors don't open? If you play that the SB cannot fire as the doors are shut...then you have surely to play the occupants never get out?
That line of reasoning would mean that most players could never have Units Disembark from Transports (not just Drop Pods, but any) since most players tend to glue hatches shut. I think the issue is how to deal with the True Line of Sight rules, rather than Disembark rules. I think that it is perfectly reasonable to claim that the closed hatches will block LOS in all cases, including for the weapons inside.

[dannyat2460]

I used to play a drop pod army in many comps and it does bring up a lot of problems, as for the LOS/deployment issue i keep the doors shut (although inside is painted to get my self some painting points) so this means i can measure from the hull for everything and even tho yes you can see through an open drop pod its just easier to keep the doors shut to block LOS for both you and your apponent as for the storm bolter ive never had a problem with firing them with closed doors even in the GT. If you have any problems tho it is just a storm bolter normaly dosnt make that much of a difference in game turms so just go ya what ever mate if your scared of a storm bolter maybe you should surrender now, it normaly annoys them enough to say fine go on then lol

[tongalad]

Saying that the clamped shut doors block line of sight is not valid under the rules which state that upon landing the drop pod doors basically explode open on impact. If my opponent claimed I could not see his uniti behind/through a drop pod because it's doors are shut I'd not be too happy. Conversely I'd be happy to let him shoot his SB or DW launcher...but you cant work it one way for TLOS yet claim the occpants got out due to the doors being blown open...It makessense that if occupants got out = the doors are open = you can shoot through the drop pod (whether the model you choose to represent it is open or not).

[Dingareth]

When the Drop Pod first came out I had this problem. I wanted to keep the doors up to block LoS (before tongalad says it, yes, it's because I'm a WAAC jerk :p); however, if I'm paying for the Storm Bolter, I'm going to use it. A little cutting, a Rhino hatch and Storm Bolter fits perfectly on top.

It took me half as long to paint, and is even more effective in game. Never had anone complain about it either across seven or so states where I used them.

[BuFFo]

Following the rules for Drop Pods, you have to open your doors. You cannot keep them shut.

[lobster-overlord]

And thereby, if they are glued shut, the assumption is that you can draw LOS through the vehicle, irregardless.

Which is how we played it the other night with my DP.

[Tynskel]

as opposed to 'regardless'
Whoops Trollin'. :P

From a fluff standpoint, the explosive bolts are there to make sure the occupants are able to disembark quickly. This does not mean that the doors are actually busted. Explosive bolts do not equal door cannot close. What explosive bolts mean is that the doors must open on the turn the pod comes in.

'Once the Drop Pod has landed, the hatches are blown and all passengers must immediately disembark, as normal. Once the passengers have disembarked, no models can embark on the Drop Pod for the remainder of the game.' p.69 C:SM.

From a rules standpoint, there is no reason why the doors cannot close. I do not think it makes sense that you could close the doors on the turn you land, due to the hatches being blown, but subsequent turn, I don't see why the doors couldn't close. Of course, it isn't explicitly stated either way. Obviously, this will be decided upon by a game by game basis. Flip the coin, or in the case that Lerra Brings up: the tournament specific rules make the decision for you.

Although, those tournament specific rules are pretty awesome. Makes the Drop Pod a much more tactically useful vehicle, leading to better games.