what does codex dark eldar tell us about the next eldar dex

[davel]

I'm a eldar veteran and in the words of anakin skywalker " I will not turn to the dark side". so I'm looking through the dark ekdar dex with an eye on what it tells us about the eldar.

as an eldar player we have had to accept that DE are faster but flimsier.

also new codexs tend to keep rules that have worked well in the past with out breaking the. the reavers over passing rule won't break the game as several units have similar abilities ( deff copters) and of course feel no pain.

and you can't do dark eldar without looking at eldar.

Firsrt warriors vs guardians. Well the book fluff makes it clear that the warriors spend their lives fighting to get on these raids. So it makes sense that their stats match that of aspect warriors with rubbish armor. So this means guardian stats are going to stay the same (comparatively rubbish due to not fighting all the time) there There are more Dark eldar than eldar think. So the warriors large squad size would be a good indication of eldar guardian size.
guardians do need some improvement so I would hope more heavy weapons for larger squads. guardian vs warrior not much has changed. the poison makes little odds to a guardian ( though wraith constructs will suffer). warriors have gone up in points, but warriors power through pain is a bargain if they can kill something.

quins is interesting. with previous dex the warriors were perceived to be better than guardians yet the same points. gav thorpe answered this with the eldar esq wisdom of " the points represent the value of thetroop to the army " and this satisfied us for five min. so when we went to ask what that actually meant he had escaped out the fire exit.
With quins being the same points in both dex means this philosophy is dead (?). quins current balance nicely with scorps and banshee having their own niche. Eldar elites do tend to be dominated by cheap fire dragon units in transports.
though i can see why GW has done this (same units sold to more players) it does make it hard to say introduce the solitaire in the eldar dex.

icnubi = aspect warriors ( Sort of as they start out as warriors)
They tend my thinking towards that there won't be major changes but small tweaks. When 5th came out eldar players were worried that due to wound allocation exarchs would fall easily and powers/ wargear were a waste. this did not pan out and this seems to be a case if it aint broke.
Their exarch has 2 powers and 2 extra wargear choices on to maximise squad and one giving it something different. essentially just like an exarch
they do have 3+ sv and fleet but i think that goes with their faster
their special character is ( in terms of stats, though not actually said in fluff) a phenix lord but slightly better as he benefits from DE rules and has one extra special rule. So phenix lords won't change much.

vehicles

ariel assault is some thing I'm hoping for all our vehicles as under slung shuricannons need it. If this is the year of the flyer super sonic is something that that our flyers may get. though it's anyones guess if that would be a FA or HS slot.

vyper =venom sort of
This (or something very similar) was first seen in citadel journal harli codex and was described as being vyper like. Certainly the DE codex piccy looks vyper esq. It seems over gunned (if cat=riffle and Scan=Scan, mm may need to rethink that last one) it has the same gunnage as a cheap vyper plus 5 guys. it does not have ariel assault but then it does not need it as all guns are defensive. the retro jets are interesting as a upgrade that eldar may get for vehicles.

characters

only one with eternal warrior is the icnubi see Phoenix lord
there is one that hints that far seers may help get the side you want.
a few of them alter your chances of seizing 1st turn or side. this may be replacing strategy rating, which may have ramifications for autarch.

weapons
they have 1 weapon that allows no invulnerable saves. though istant death weapons are plentiful and are a good way of defeating them as well
dark= bright no change apart from cheaper for DE though i think this balances with the amount of punishment they can take from tanks. I'm not expecting an eldar points drop.
melta lance thing. fire dragons started with melta guns then GW decreed all races have own unique weapons so we had inferior(?) fusion gun. then last codex back to melta. It just does not sit right. fire dragons will get looked at ( we are a dying race, but if we all form in to fire dragon suicide squads we can win battles) so we may end up with something similar ( but not dark).


well end of the surmising/ rant

what do you reckon?

dave l

[BuFFo]

As long as Eldar Tanks remain 1) Tanks 2) Unkillable through wargear, Eldar should never get Aerial Assault.

Remember, DE paid for the 24" movement with our jetbike's extra points for 12 years, and that includes when all bikes got turbo boosting. Now you want our Aerial Assault on your Tanks that never die?

The only thing I agree with is that Guardians have been pure garbage for 12 years. They need to stop making their guns 12". Make their gun 18" for sucks fake.

[Image]

What I believe it tells us is that we can expect a general point reduction for several units, while hopefully making some units more appealing.

Outside of point costs, I don't see too much wrong with the Eldar codex that it desperately needs updating. If anything though, the DE codex tells us that the next Eldar codex will be better organized.

[davel]

As long as Eldar Tanks remain 1) Tanks 2) Unkillable through wargear, Eldar should never get Aerial Assault.

Remember, DE paid for the 24" movement with our jetbike's extra points for 12 years, and that includes when all bikes got turbo boosting. Now you want our Aerial Assault on your Tanks that never die?

The only thing I agree with is that Guardians have been pure garbage for 12 years. They need to stop making their guns 12". Make their gun 18" for sucks fake.

I would like to state clearly that I have always played eldar and the reason I picked them was they were hard to play ( and I loved the models). I don't want them to be unbeatable. I want to see them work as they are supposed.

Certainly the last codex certainly made them more killable than the last, it just that the shuriken cannon up grade for catapults is just odd with out it.
As for unkillable war gear. I'd like to see the holofeild match up with the serpent feild my typical in game conversations go as follows.
" Ha foul eldar scum I have clear shots on your rear your holofeild is of no use"
" No this is a holofeild, and has no such stipulation."
" Well then I'll charge in and get around it that way"
" No this is a holofeild, and has no such stipulation."

I'd like to see the holofeild work front and sides with no rear or close combat protection

I'd like to see it giving a cover save which improves when you move faster, To fit with the fluff.
How ever apocalypse has it working as an invunerable save, which does match up with dark eldar wargear

dave L

[BuFFo]

I'd like to see it giving a cover save which improves when you move faster, To fit with the fluff. How ever apocalypse has it working as an invunerable save, which does match up with dark eldar wargear

Just go Flat Out then.

[Defenestratus]

A couple things that I think we should look for in the any new Eldar Dex (I'll try to keep the wishlisting to a minimum):

Revision of the shuriken catapult. Whatever justification there was for slashing its range to 12" has long since gone by the way side. Time to make it 18" (and 24" for the Avenger Cat)

Tweaking the exarch wargear and powers so there are no more irrelevant powers (like the one that allows warp spiders to deep strike). Also make some of the worthless powers and aspects more viable through either buffing or costing or both.

Points cost rebalancing. There's no justification to be given for why a guardian costs 8 points but an Ork boy costs 6. Likewise for our tanks and bright lances and starcannons.

And, then we get to the topics of our tanks. Personally I don't see a problem with them now except for the fact that the wave serpents are probably 20-40 pts to expensive. As for my BuFFo's assertion that they are unkillable, I'd respectfully disagree. Autocannons, missile launchers and a plethora of other str 7+ cheap heavy weapons (even assault cannons) will make short work of them. The wave serpent, in the end is just an AV12 vehicle with no smoke launchers. Easier to pop than a predator or a dread. I would like to see some more customizing available for the serpents though - to better match their occupants. For example, assault ramps. How the Eldar have existed for Millenia without assault ramps is beyond my understanding :)

The phoenix lords need an inv save. Thats all. Otherwise they're fine.

[DarkLink]

Well, wave serpents may not be unkillable, per se, but they are impressively durable. I've seen them soak up more firepower than any other AV 12 vehicle would have any right to survive.

But, yeah, eldar stuff is pretty regularly overpriced. And the overabundance of BS 3 hurts them. You end up with overpriced weapons that miss way too often on otherwise decent platforms a lot.

[Defenestratus]

Well, wave serpents may not be unkillable, per se, but they are impressively durable. I've seen them soak up more firepower than any other AV 12 vehicle would have any right to survive.

Let me guess, probably melta weapons and lascannons were shooting them. Without holofields, they are slightly more durable than your average rhino.

People who shoot at serpents with guns that work well against other tanks are typically let down. Autocannons just rip up my stuff but hardly anyone takes them because they don't do well against other armies.

[Archon Charybdis]

While I wouldn't expect to see the Aerial Assault rule for Eldar, I would like to see some greater ability to move and shoot for Eldar vehicles. Aerial Assault on Falcons would be too much, but maybe something along the lines of being able to fire one S6 weapon as a defensive weapon. This would make under-slung shuricannons actually usable, and make the Falcon a little more viable at it's dual battlefield roles of transport and gunboat.

[Lordgimpet]

I will post a more details response when i have more time but just to add to this for now
Some quick thoughts, eldar dont need airal assault, can offset this by making the transports have the asault rule, I think nightwings, and void dragons etc will be added and the DE equivelents in the codex indecate this.

[DarkLink]

People who shoot at serpents with guns that work well against other tanks are typically let down. Autocannons just rip up my stuff but hardly anyone takes them because they don't do well against other armies.

Well, autocannons kill any AV12. But how many AV 12 vehicles can laugh off a barrage of str 10 hits or melta shots?

And, for that matter, how many vehicles can reroll their cover saves, and have access to holofields?

My point that a wave serpent is just about the most durable AV 12 vehicle in the game still stands.




Besides, we don't have many autocannons where I play, so for me that's kinda a moot point.

[BuFFo]

Eldar Transports are priced right, especially since it takes an army to bring a single transport down.

What I would like Eldar to have is better basic troopers, and the ability to Assault out of their Transports.

The second Harlequins and Banshees can assault out of a vehicle which is harder to kill than a Landraider, then you'll have happy Eldar players.

The reason why I am perfectly happy with having the game's weakest transport be 60 points base is because I can launch Wyches out of them on turn one. That is what I am paying 60 points for. If Eldar players had Guardians that had decent weapons that could fire BEYOND assault range, and have the ability to assault out of their transports, then I think the Eldar book will be fine.

The argument that certain weapons can down Eldar vehicles isn't too strong because not all armies HAVE those weapons. You have to look across the broad spectrum of weaponry in all armies. When a Railgun hits my Raiders, no dice needs to be rolled because it is an auto pen. When the same gun hits your Waveserpent, you mine as well be playing with 16 Landraiders glued together.

1) Improve the basic Guardian gun to fire beyond 12".
2) Allow units in an Eldar Transport to assault out of it, maybe as standard, or a cheap 5 point upgrade.

[Duke]

I personally feel that elder vehicles are overpriced, don't ask me what I think they should cost cause I haven't thought that far... But since I have a huge elder army I would say they are a bit overpriced at the moment.

Duke

[DarkLink]

Eldar Transports are priced right, especially since it takes an army to bring a single transport down.

I will agree, with the sole exception that some of the weapon options are too expensive, and that BS 3 sucks.



2) Allow units in an Eldar Transport to assault out of it, maybe as standard, or a cheap 5 point upgrade.

Fully agree. Or at least allow one of the Eldar vehicles to be an assault vehicle. Banshees and Scorpions are very hard to fit into mech lists in my experience because, even as mobile as the Eldar are, it's tough to move up, wait a full turn, then try to assault. The cc aspects would be so much more intimidating with that 20"+ threat range.

[BuFFo]

I will agree, with the sole exception that some of the weapon options are too expensive, and that BS 3 sucks.

I know this is going to go waaay off topic, but I feel that as standard, every army should be BS4 for a plethora of reasons. The only two armies which would stay BS3 and BS2 would be IG and Orks respectively.

I think the game would make more sense this way, and it would give elite armies a real elite feel, and horde armies a horde feel.

All Eldar should be BS4. All their Vehicles should be BS4. It shows how a culture based on survival and war is well trained to defend their Craftworld.

[Defenestratus]

BuFFo,

I'll take 4 wave serpents against you in one of our first games and you can see just how easy they are the kill. Missile launchers make quick and dirty work out of them.

[BuFFo]

BuFFo,

I'll take 4 wave serpents against you in one of our first games and you can see just how easy they are the kill. Missile launchers make quick and dirty work out of them.

No offense, but you are talking down to me like I I haven't faced Eldar before in my 22 years of playing the game.

It seems you are the one out of touch, because since when do Dark Eldar have Missile Launchers? Our strength 8 weapons now cost 25 points.

When my Dark Lances were just 10 points each, even then, I would fire lance after lance (at 'ONLY' 36" by the way) only to keep seeing a result of a 1, 1, 1, 1, 1, maybe a weapon destroyed, because of all the trickery Eldar Vehicle Wargear does.

my old Sniper Squads would fire two Dark Lances. Lets say both hit. Then only one of them would do anything, lets say pen. Then the Eldar player would roll two dice, and force my result down to the bottom half of the average roll, and being that 2's downgrade to 1, more often than not, the only result I would ever see is a 1. That was with 10 point Dark Lances.

The only times I would beat Eldar was when the player was stupid enough to disembark anything out of their vehicles. Other than this, Eldar could only tie me at best, going for the last turn objective grab, because that is what Eldar is good at, forcing ties.

Your argument seems to be coming from a person who only ever plays Marines and only expects to play Marines! I don't play Marines, I have self respect... :p :p

But please, come on down and lets rock! I bet you that your army deploys entirely in vehicles, and you won't come out unless you really have to... -snicker-

All smack talk and joking aside, I understand you may come from a metagame where most of your opponents just spammed Missile Launchers to counter you. Your Eldar Tanks will go unmolested around my area.

[addamsfamily36]

Tweaking the exarch wargear and powers so there are no more irrelevant powers (like the one that allows warp spiders to deep strike). Also make some of the worthless powers and aspects more viable through either buffing or costing or both.


HA

this made me laugh.

Ok not many people take warp spiders, but i take them because i love their fluff and their look (artworkwise not so much model wise, although the exarch still rocks in my opinions)

anyways, warpsiders being able too deepstrike is amazing!

deepstrike down, unload 20ish (depending on squad size and wargear) strength 6 shots, then in the assault phase hop away. with their short range weapons its perfect. running them across the board is just suicide, although it depends what your facing, but its one of the more useful powers.

[DarkLink]

If only warp spiders weren't ap -...


All Eldar should be BS4. All their Vehicles should be BS4. It shows how a culture based on survival and war is well trained to defend their Craftworld.

Heck, I think it would be cool if Eldar/DE were base BS/WS 5. It would give a bit more of that really "skilled but fragile" feel.

[addamsfamily36]

If only warp spiders weren't ap -...

I hear ya.

I do find that the sheer number of high strength shots is usually enough though. Particularly nice against slightly higher toughness units. :D

[BuFFo]

Warp Spiders can instant kill Dark Eldar HQs.... Scary stuff if anything...

[scadugenga]

anyways, warpsiders being able too deepstrike is amazing!

Um. In 5th ed, all jump infantry deep strike for free. No exarch powers required. That was a 4th ed convention where deep striking was limited to certain scenarios. That restriction was removed in 5th ed.

So yes, the "always able to deep strike" exarch ability is superfluous.

[Lordgimpet]

Ok now with more time to type I can add a bit more to this, I will try to look at it section by section.
starting with HQ,
Seers could do with a fraction of tweaking in the current edition they are expencive for what you get, removing the cost for powers would ease this but to be frank the Eldar are the most psycic of all ther races and should reflect this far better, I like the buff style of powers in use, but could also be taken further mabey each unit in the force that contains a warlock or seer (council counts as one) their power become more powerful/easier to use. etc.

Autarch I love but they just seem to fall short of the mark, perhaps making the aspecs purchasable like marks of chaos for bonuses/equipment upgrades.

Avatar, needs nothing more than a stat line tweak or if I had my way the god he was for a measley 80pts.

Pheonix lords need work, what would be cool would be that if you took a particular lord, then that aspec becomes a troops choice.

Troops
Eldar troops need a bit of work, 12" range weapons make guardians a waste bump it to 18", make s-cannons man portable and or throw in some fusion gun options and they looking far better. not only that like almost every other army out there give them a pistol,some grenades as well.. for free mabey a haywire upgrade for points and they looking solid

Dire Avengers dont need much besides something to make their weapons better than the guardians,
keep it 18" but increase the Str or lower the AP or make em work as if they poisoned

Fast Attack
just needs points cost adjustments on all the choices here, as well as the 4th ed redundancies
though i feel the Warp spiders and Swooping hawks should be able to Deep strike with an accuracy that runs rings around Comander Dante, as well as being able to assault lol

Vipers are fine just their options need to be alot cheaper and not be opened topped.

Elites,
Harlequins won't change and I feel the other choices don't need to really either perhaps some customisation like 1 per 10 banshees can replace pistol and sword for mirror swords, that sort of thing
and say cost 12 points each.

Heavy support,
All tanks need BS 4 and some upgrade for searchlights/acute senses. a few more upgrades and the cost reduced for some to minimise the cost blowout and end up having transports costing more than the unit they are ferrying. they dont need airborne assault as unlike Ravagers they only have 1 main weapon anyway. yes can have 2 if you upgrade to s-cannons. falcons have 2 but as I run with a EML the plasma missle is treated as a defencive weapon being str 4. A wish would be Prism tanks to be bought in a squadron to free up a HS slot but that is wishful thinking.

Transports need to be cheaper. something like assult ramps to make the cost more justified and assault troops more effective.

All in all I feel the only thing it needs is tweaking in the points cost, perferably a cost reduction to be able to field more.

[Defenestratus]

my old Sniper Squads would fire two Dark Lances. Lets say both hit. Then only one of them would do anything, lets say pen. Then the Eldar player would roll two dice, and force my result down to the bottom half of the average roll, and being that 2's downgrade to 1, more often than not, the only result I would ever see is a 1. That was with 10 point Dark Lances.

Ahh BuFFo, you're talking about Holofields - yeah those are annoying but unfortunately the wave serpents cannot get them. The only defensive wargear the WS can get is spirit stones which is basically like extra armor. Its also got a defensive field that downgrades all > str 8 shots to str 8, and eliminates any extra dice being rolled for armor penetration, so melta and rending hits only roll 1D6 for AP. To your dark lances, its the same as killing a dreadnought @ AV12. Thats it :) Falcons and Fireprisms come off the factory floor with holofields, which forces you to roll 2D6 for the damage and take the lowest result. Thats bloody annoying and hard to kill, I'll admit.

[isotope99]

I don't think the dark eldar codex tells us a huge amount about the next eldar codex, at least no more than any other dex i.e. cheaper troops, new SCs that change army composition etc.

Speculatioons:

I like the idea of Phoenix lords making their aspects troops but maybe restrict it to one unit like the ork warboss. A farseer could make a single unit of wraithguard troops etc.
I imagine that holofields will get a downgrade to being an optional reroll on the damage table. This is less powerful than picking the lower result and fits with the new damage tables.
No open topped transports, too similar to dark eldar.
Increased range for guardians.
Flyers like the dark eldar to represent equivalents of the nightwing and phoenix.
One of the exarch powers included in the price of the unit for each aspect rather than being purchased separately (e.g. Scorpions get infiltrate automatically, Dire avengers bladestorm etc.) The current system discriminates against smaller units like the marks of chaos.


For me the interesting question is whether Craftworld Eldar will be one of the last fifth edition armies or one of the first sixth edition armies (same with CSM):confused:.

[Defenestratus]

For me the interesting question is whether Craftworld Eldar will be one of the last fifth edition armies or one of the first sixth edition armies (same with CSM).

Probably the former, just like this codex was. It was a top tier 4ed codex and a middle hat 5ed codex. Some thing will probably happen again.

[addamsfamily36]

Um. In 5th ed, all jump infantry deep strike for free. No exarch powers required. That was a 4th ed convention where deep striking was limited to certain scenarios. That restriction was removed in 5th ed.

So yes, the "always able to deep strike" exarch ability is superfluous.

Hmmm, didn't think of this. i shall have to have a little gander when i get back from uni.

cheers

[Drew da Destroya]

I have a friend that uses Warp Spiders to pretty devastating effect... of course, I play Orks and Dark Eldar, so AP - is not that big of a downside. He usually takes hit and run, so even if I do catch the *******s, they get away and blast me again. He tends to use them for light armor hunting first, popping my trukks/raiders/ravagers, and then blasting away at anyone caught out in the open.

I'd like to see some of the Aspects tweaked a bit... personally, I feel like the Swooping Hawks could be a lot cooler. It seems like they started as an anti-light infantry unit, but then had some kind of anti-vehicle role tacked on, and now they're just confused. I'd really like to see them pushed fully into an anti-horde role... maybe buff the grenade pack, scrap the "always hit vehicles on a 4+" power and replace it with something that enhances their shooting (reroll wounds?), and give them an accurate deep strike.

Possibly a melee exarch power, so they can finish off weakened squads?

[Defenestratus]

They work wonders on lootas that are sitting in the back of the table.

[Melissia]

Nothing, really, they're as separate as Space Wolves and Blood Angels.

More separate, really.

[DarkLink]

He tends to use them for light armor hunting first, popping my trukks/raiders/ravagers, and then blasting away at anyone caught out in the open.


Yeah, against anything that has more than paper for armor they don't work quite so well.

[addamsfamily36]

To be fair, when you have a unit such as fire dragons, you don't really need to take warp spiders to pop open tanks with.

[DarkLink]

The problem with fire dragons is that they can tend to fly up, blow up something, then get killed next turn. Warp Spiders, on the other hand, can jump back out of range and hopefully survive.

[addamsfamily36]

The problem with fire dragons is that they can tend to fly up, blow up something, then get killed next turn. Warp Spiders, on the other hand, can jump back out of range and hopefully survive.

which is why i take warp spiders lol.

I mean i think that the most annoying part of the eldar codex is that there are so many awesome unit types, all of which specialise in one aspect.

Its nothing new, but they are almost too specific. spending 200 points on a unit that can do ONE thing is a hefty amount.

fire dragons for instance, great for opening up a tank, but as you say they then get left out in the open for a turn which usually finishes them off. Also if you write them into a balanced list, as soon as you face a horde army, they become a very costly and low impacting unit, unless hunting carnifexes etc.

[Image]

which is why i take warp spiders lol.

I mean i think that the most annoying part of the eldar codex is that there are so many awesome unit types, all of which specialise in one aspect.

Its nothing new, but they are almost too specific. spending 200 points on a unit that can do ONE thing is a hefty amount.

fire dragons for instance, great for opening up a tank, but as you say they then get left out in the open for a turn which usually finishes them off. Also if you write them into a balanced list, as soon as you face a horde army, they become a very costly and low impacting unit, unless hunting carnifexes etc.

Pretty much the only thing Fire Dragons aren't good at killing are hordes. Sure, a unit of five of them will only kill 4 of those 10 tactical marines, but they're only half the cost. Add in another five for an equivalent cost and they'll kill tanks, monstrous creatures, MEQ, terminators (non-assault... wait do non-assault termies exist anymore?), bikes, etc. Fire Dragons die so quickly because they are a threat to everything (but hordes), so play them smart.

[Blackyujiro]

Other than some points reductions, Shuriken Catapult improving, and hopefully making Farseers and Warlocks psychic powerhouses again(as the Space Wolves seem to have surpassed them). I don't think much will change.

I don't see them getting "flyers" either. They already have access to 3 skimmer tanks, one of which has transport capabilities. DE have simply been brought up to 3 of their own(adding the Voidraven and Razorwing).

I would like to see the Craftworld rules come back though. Aspects as Troops were awesom..to me anyway.

[addamsfamily36]

Pretty much the only thing Fire Dragons aren't good at killing are hordes. Sure, a unit of five of them will only kill 4 of those 10 tactical marines, but they're only half the cost. Add in another five for an equivalent cost and they'll kill tanks, monstrous creatures, MEQ, terminators (non-assault... wait do non-assault termies exist anymore?), bikes, etc. Fire Dragons die so quickly because they are a threat to everything (but hordes), so play them smart.

It was perhaps using the fire dragons as an example, that made my point not as clear as i intended.

What I'm saying is, in the eldar codex there is an elite unit for almost every different aspect of the game. combat, anti mech, etc etc

This is a good thing.

But you are restricted because of it. its fine having one hard hitting unit, but if the rest of the army is like paper then it will lose. thats why you usually see a lot of eldar armies that have an extremely similar army build, one that wins. But they are usually spamtastic.

[Daemonette666]

As long as Eldar Tanks remain 1) Tanks 2) Unkillable through wargear, Eldar should never get Aerial Assault.

Remember, DE paid for the 24" movement with our jetbike's extra points for 12 years, and that includes when all bikes got turbo boosting. Now you want our Aerial Assault on your Tanks that never die?

The only thing I agree with is that Guardians have been pure garbage for 12 years. They need to stop making their guns 12". Make their gun 18" for sucks fake.
Maybe they will increase it to 18" range for Guardians, you never know boffo. With the current trend from GW - that of codex creep where the next codex is ever so slightly better or has some really nasty character made into a super character, you can expect the Eldar will get a few nice perks, and some nasty characters.

I just hope the Sisters of Battle and the Chaos Space Marines also get a nice dose of codex creep to help them cope against some of the revamped armies like Tyranids, Blood Angels, Space Wolves, and Dark Eldar. We just need rest of them to get updated - in the coarse of time. LOL

[BuFFo]

Maybe they will increase it to 18" range for Guardians, you never know boffo. With the current trend from GW - that of codex creep where the next codex is ever so slightly better or has some really nasty character made into a super character, you can expect the Eldar will get a few nice perks, and some nasty characters.

40k has not had codex creep in 5th edition at all. What seems like strong codices, IG and BA, is just a side effect of cheap vehicles in a core rule where vehicles are finally good to take after 2 decades of this game.

Of course, which army suffered the most because of no vehicles? Tyranids. But even Tyranids is strong if players stop trying to make monster lists and think outside the box.


I just hope the Sisters of Battle and the Chaos Space Marines also get a nice dose of codex creep to help them cope against some of the revamped armies like Tyranids, Blood Angels, Space Wolves, and Dark Eldar. We just need rest of them to get updated - in the coarse of time. LOL

If the trend in 5th edition continues where all 5th edition codices are balanced with each other, then you have nothing to worry about!

[davel]

Pheonix lords need work, what would be cool would be that if you took a particular lord, then that aspec becomes a troops choice.



Heavy support,
All tanks need BS 4 and some upgrade for searchlights/acute senses. a few more upgrades and the cost reduced for some to minimise the cost blowout and end up having transports costing more than the unit they are ferrying.

Transports need to be cheaper. something like assult ramps to make the cost more justified and assault troops more effective.

.

looking at the dark eldar "pheonix" lord he has 1 extra ability ( and a boost from dark eldar rules e.g. fnp) but no actual invulnerable save. it is hard to see how to boost phenix lords with out him being codex creeped.
Though I do agree the 5th ed thing we do not have is troop shifting( making an elite a troop ala warboss and nob bikers, not that I'm bitter about that) charicters. dark eldar have 2 so we may see this.

true we can shift wraithguard to troops but unless your wraith mad it tends not to be a common choice.

on the transport front new f QA rulling on moving with flat out passengers may make vectored engines a necessity ( as well as spirit stones) further up pricing our transports.

dave l

[davel]

O.k got a look at grey knights

most interested in the ordo xenos character runes of destiny (ability to force rerolls on opponent amour)

I can just imagine the conversation between the seer council and the farseer on this (" you mean we could of got through that power armour all along?!" )

with that and the dark eldar bones of the seer, are we going to see these in the new goodies in the elader dex?

runes of destiny rerolling invun saves is great on power weapons but with witch blades the invun bit is probably only useful on deamons and other seer councils. though fluff indicates it is underpowered compared to full eldar runes.

there was one other thing that caught my eye the inquisitor has a invun from what description and rules appear something identical to a certain autarch piece of gear. Is that a indication that autrch protection won't change ( I don't think it should, it works fine, I don't want my eldar being terminators)?

what are your views?

dave ( desperately clutching at straws though tau and crons need it more) l

[Astral Platypus]

I don't think the dark eldar codex tells us a huge amount about the next eldar codex, at least no more than any other dex i.e. cheaper troops, new SCs that change army composition etc.


It does say one thing about the Eldar codex; probably no return for the Solitaire in the Harlequins :(

[Cyberscape7]

Why is it that so many other races get psychic powers for free (some of which can kill a daemon prince instantly(you know what I'm talking about)) and the eldar, most powerful psykers in 40k apparently, have to pay a large amount of points for them. This may just be me, but I reckon that they should bulk up the price of farseers and warlocks slightly, let warlocks have one of their powers for no points, and have the farseer get 2 powers no cost and and extra 2 for maybe 10 points a piece? Anyone else have thoughts on their powers?
Oh also if anyone has read Path of the Warrior, then those beacons the rangers use to help the eldar deep strike are something I would quite like to see in the new dex

[Demonus]

Id like to see:

W Spiders and S Hawks only deviate 1d6 inches when deep striking, or allow a reroll on scatter dice.

Farseers come with 1 power free, option to buy additional power

Phoenix Lords revamped. No one uses them as they are awful, with only 1 having an invuln save. Phoenix Lords allowing their Aspect Warriors to count as troops is a good idea. Or at the least, scoring units.

Autarchs given a perk that makes them viable over a 2 farseer army

Prisms become 1-2 with no restriction of being within 4" of each other like Tomb Spyders. Also a secondary weapon, even a TL Shuriken Catapult upgradable to cannon for when the main gun gets shot off in round 1.

An assault vehicle for Scorpions and Banshees. Either a separate mold vehicle that is an open topped skimmer or an upgrade option for Wave Serpents that convert them to an assault vehicle (for x amount of points)

More characters, perhaps named Exarchs that you could buy (like Telion or Commander Pask) for additional points instead of a normal Exarch

Guardians to have 1 weapon platform per 5 guardians in squad (max 3). Upgrade guardian gun to 18" range.
Also why limit fusion/flamer upgrades to storm guardians? All guardians should be allowed to have 2 of these weapons per squad. Now the laughable guardians have 2 fusion guns and 2 weapon platforms to deal with (even with their BS 3).

Storm Guardians....something needs to be done to make them better. I like the idea of them, but they are still pretty laughable in cc. They need a power weapon option, and a "Sgt" upgrade to lead them.

Avatar...needs EW, a point reduction, improved init, or some kinda upgrade. Unless he is babysat by a farseer, he usually dies in 1 round and he is an awesome concept.


I like my eldar, I just dont often play them as I think Space Wolves, Vulkan Marines and Chaos are more versitile and have a better chance of winning (for me at least)