Can one model multi-charge?

[albertsevil]

Evening all,

Simple question, can one model charge two units?
Had this happen last night when I charged two units of guardsmen with one defiler. Never had any previous problems multi-charging, nor have my gaming group.

I don't have my codex on me so all I can remember is the assaulting unit must move to be in base contact with the closest model of the group being charged. Does this have to be a straight line? My opponent said that only units with two or models can multi-assault as the first model must assault the one enemy unit and then the second can charge another squad.

Apologies if this has been asked elsewhere.

[JxKxR]

I think as long as you have at least two attacks you can split them up.

[Culven]

JxKxR, I think you are misunderstanding the question. Albertsevil is asking about Assault Moves, not splitting attacks.

Albertsevil, your opponent is correct. The rules require that the first model moved in an Asssault be the model closest to the Unit being assaulted and it must be moved via the shortest route (not necessarily along a line if there are models or terrain to go around). A multiple charge isn't declared, and can only result if subsequently moved models in the assaulting unit can make base contact with other enemy units. The only time there tends to be an issue is when the assaulting unit is a single model which cannot manage to make base contact with the enemy unit without also being placed in base contact with other units. However, many players tend to use a house rule that allows the assault rules to be bent a bit so that the single-model unit can be moved into base contact with multiple enemy units. Just keep in mind that this is not really by the rules.

[albertsevil]

Thank you. Will read through the rules again tonight, but Culven makes sense.

Shame really, there are plenty of times my greater daemon is big enough to hit two units. etc. Also means that if my opponent is clever he can keep his units fairly close together and potentially stop me assaulting as I can't move to within 1" of an unengaged enemy model. Damn.

But fairs fair, I'm British and we play by the rules ;)

Good gaming to all

[JxKxR]

Yeah I totally missed what he was trying to ask, but now I have a question. Can somebody stop a single model from assaulting if they intertwine two units so that they can't get into base contact without being 1" away?

[BuFFo]

It is impossible to assault two units with a single model. Your model will always be closer to one of the units than the other.

Now, if you have a Square base, it becomes easier to do, but still pretty hard.

Circular bases pretty much axes out the possibility of doing such a maneuver.

[Tynskel]

It is impossible to assault two units with a single model. Your model will always be closer to one of the units than the other.

Now, if you have a Square base, it becomes easier to do, but still pretty hard.

Circular bases pretty much axes out the possibility of doing such a maneuver.

Actually, a single model can charge two units (note, I am not stating single model units). The Assault rules have just enough flexibility that you do not have to have models charge closest to closest, just that they engage enemy models that have not been engaged from the unit, if they can reach them. There is nothing stating you cannot engage the free enemy model, and have it touch a second at the same time.

When I am playing bugs, I do this all the time. Have a squad of 20 hormaguants, it isn't too hard to squeeze them in and then force a second unit to engage the horms. If ya do it right, the second unit doesn't get to fight (majority of the models are too far away to fight), and you lock them up! Allowing your following assault phase time to bring your BIG friends in :).

[Culven]

Can somebody stop a single model from assaulting if they intertwine two units so that they can't get into base contact without being 1" away?
Not anymore. In fourth edition, it was possible. In fifth edition, there is no restriction that models stay at least 1" away from enemy units during the Assault Phase (even units they are not assaulting), it still applies during the Movement Phase.


Actually, a single model can charge two units (note, I am not stating single model units). The Assault rules have just enough flexibility that you do not have to have models charge closest to closest, just that they engage enemy models that have not been engaged from the unit, if they can reach them. There is nothing stating you cannot engage the free enemy model, and have it touch a second at the same time.
You lost me. If a single-model unit is attempting to charge, then it is required to move by the shortest path to get into base contact with the closest model in the enemy unit being assaulted. So, it is unlikely that it would be able to make it to base contact with a model from another unit without fudging the path.

[SeattleDV8]

You lost me. If a single-model unit is attempting to charge, then it is required to move by the shortest path to get into base contact with the closest model in the enemy unit being assaulted. So, it is unlikely that it would be able to make it to base contact with a model from another unit without fudging the path.

I believe he is refering to models assaulting after the first.

[BuFFo]

I believe he is refering to models assaulting after the first.

Ahh....

I read the OP's question as the Assaulting unit consists of only a single model, like a Carnifex or a Chaplain.

If you have a multi-model unit, then yes, after the first model charges, you can take a second model and push that sucker against two enemy models in separate units if they are close enough.

[Culven]

I read the OP's question as the Assaulting unit consists of only a single model, like a Carnifex or a Chaplain.
That is the situation proposed in the first post. The scenario was a single Defiler attempting to assault two units of Imperial Guard. That is why I was confused as refering to multiple-model units assaulting had nothing to do with the original question and isn't typically contested.

[Bean]

It is theoretically possible for there to be a situation in which a single model can actually end up in base-to-base contact with two models from separate units by following the assault rules.

In general, though, it's not going to happen.

[SeattleDV8]

It is theoretically possible for there to be a situation in which a single model can actually end up in base-to-base contact with two models from separate units by following the assault rules.

In general, though, it's not going to happen.

Even if the geometry works, a very rare occurence as you stated, the rules tend to imply you still could not.
BRB pg. 34 "....assaulting models.. {snip}.. may not move into base contact with enemy models from a unit they are not assaulting."
The first model must assault the declared unit.
"Then remaining models can assault models belonging to other enemy units..."
The timing seems to disallow the first model from coming BTB with any other unit.

[Bean]

Even if the geometry works, a very rare occurence as you stated, the rules tend to imply you still could not.
BRB pg. 34 "....assaulting models.. {snip}.. may not move into base contact with enemy models from a unit they are not assaaulting."
The first model must assault the declared unit.
"Then remaining models can assault models belonging to other enemy units..."
The timing seems to disallow the first model from coming BTB with any other unit.

Yeah, looks like you're right. I was thinking through the geometry, but hadn't actually sat down and read through the rules for it.

[Tynskel]

Yeah, looks like you're right. I was thinking through the geometry, but hadn't actually sat down and read through the rules for it.

hmm.
I am surprised at that statement.
I think you should probably re-read the entire section.

[Duke]

From my understanding a single model could assault two units but the chances o this perfect storm happening are socrate that the answer is effectively " no a single model cannot assault multiple units"

Duke

[Tynskel]

Have you guys ever used bugs? This happens all the time with hormagaunts.

[Bean]

It's not particularly hard to base models from more than one unit with non-initial models in the charging unit, but if the charging unit only has one model (the scenario discussed in the OP) then Seattle is right: the rules do actually prohibit it where they tell you that the first mode (the only model, in this case) must assault the target unit and that models may not move into base contact with models from units they're not assaulting.

Were there subsequent models in the assaulting unit, they could choose to assault multiple units, but the first model isn't given that choice.

[Xas]

Have you guys ever used bugs? This happens all the time with hormagaunts.

Have you ever used bugs?

It is a very seldom occurance that hormagaunts form units that consist of only one model.

And then that single hormagaunt wouldnt even want to assoult two units of tau at once...

[Tynskel]

Hah! I am forum-telephone.

[dannyat2460]

I know this post is quite old but still want to say something into it it says that the model must move the shortest distance to get into that model this is correct and if you play exactly as is written then a multiple charge is extramly hard to do however it can be done the easiest way is by saying is it ok with your apponent most will say it is fine ive even done/had it done in comps and no one has ever complained or if they are been arsy with you about it whos to say once into base contact with the nearest model you cant charge the side of it that catches that other unit stood a little too close to it