Guardians

[Cyberscape7]

After playing many games with eldar and my guardians being completley anihallated I have concluded that I need to buy a warlock. However I was also thinking about bulking out my squads to 15 man a squad and getting some scatter platforms aswell as my BL. I have to admit; when it comes to guardians I am a noob. Any tips on how I can use them more effectivley?

[phoenix01]

Storm Guardians would give them the extra CC attack as they have pistols and close combat weapons. But Guardians are a fragile unit. Dire Avangers make a slightly more sturdy troops choice. Or Rangers. Or Guardian jet bikes.

[lowdog]

Increasing their squad size and giving them a warlock just strikes me as "throwing good money after bad." I'd swap them out for other troops types. Dire Avengers are shootier, Jetbikes are more mobile and have higher saves. The weapons platforms are nice, but you have other aspect warriors that can fill whatever role you wanted that platform for.

[davel]

Guardians defender are our worst troop choice. yes they can hang back and hold an objective but any thing assulty or flamey heads your way say good bye.
but if your determined to get them to work for defender. embolden is cheap helps keep them in the game. can also help re psycics is you join a far seer. Don't bother with it if you include a avatar. Destructor not worth it if unit is on foot. Conceal is useful for holding objectives in the open but cover is usually plentiful and gives a better save. enhance only worth it on storm guardians.
Transport guardians could work how ever dire avengers work better either cheaper (5man for scoring tank effect) or more devastating ( 10 man blade storm). Storms guard with either flamers or fusion guns also work better.
scatter laser would be my first choice of gun lots of shots and over shurik cannon has range. 24 inches leaves most of your squad receiving every foes incoming fire. A bight lance is expensive and unless guided will only hit half the time. Though it will be tough for opponent to deal with.
Theres too much cover for star cannons and EML are to pricey ( also tanks will be pointing at you so EML are better on things that can sneak around the sides) and bright lances are better head on.
Sinergy
Units that work well with guardians. Any farseer enhancing power will work well though most of the time they will be directed else where e'g. guiding war walkers. Avatar fearless rules help no end

Footdar typical eldar build

OK I don't play this and hate power gaming lists but our dex is getting on and I do like to win once in a while

Avatar
far seer

guardian defenders with warlocks scatter lasers

wraith lords to the max anti tank shootyness ( warlocks help with wraith sight, and they can hit tanks and can pile in with avatar)

quins as a counter strike force shadow seer essential he also helps wraith lords like war locks

hope that helps

Dave l

[Cyberscape7]

I am tempted to get a jetbike squadron but I cant find any cheap way of collecting them. As for rangers, I akready own 5 and, for some reason, they are pathetic shots but lethal in CC. Nevertheless, I refuse to collect any more rangers unti they make a plastic box or I can be bothered to convert. Dire avengers aren't a bad idea though. I already own a unit and, when they dont get mowed down, they are pretty effective. Still I would like to find a way to make my existing guardian squads a bit more useful.

[fuzzbuket]

play 10 DA and asurmen,with possibly more DA

now for the squad

10 da exarch twin catapults, blade storm 152 pts

36 S4 AP4 (next turn useless can only run/move )


or

5 DA exarch power wepon +shimmershield OR dire sword with both powers (shimmy shield = 5+iv for the squad dire sword is a PW which once wounded tatget takes a LD, if LD failed target x_X dead)

turn 1 shoot 12 S4 AP4 shots (bladestorm)
next turn fleet and charge 8 S3 attacks + 4 dire sword attacks or 3 power weapon attacks)

not very effective if its 1 squad but when you use 2 the PARRY power comes into its own (each enemy model attack directed at the squad lose 1 attack per turn MODEL minimum of 1... so high attack units end out with 1 attack each arfter 2+ assault phases, so if 3 squads charged ^_^)




Rangers seem like a viable option as for converting guardian +milliput cloak + Plastic rod +lasgun barrel = ranger :D should take a min :P

but i havent given a though about guardians... how about using them to sit on a objective and when the enemy infiltraitors come in using them as meatshields for the warlock and weapon crew ?


cheers

-fuzz

[DarkLink]

5 DA exarch power wepon +shimmershield OR dire sword with both powers (shimmy shield = 5+iv for the squad dire sword is a PW which once wounded tatget takes a LD, if LD failed target x_X dead)

turn 1 shoot 12 S4 AP4 shots (bladestorm)
next turn fleet and charge 8 S3 attacks + 4 dire sword attacks or 3 power weapon attacks)

That's a lot of upgrades on a very fragile unit. It's not really worth taking any upgrades on a 5 DA unit. More bodies is more valuable than a power weapon with such a small squad.



not very effective if its 1 squad but when you use 2 the PARRY power comes into its own (each enemy model attack directed at the squad lose 1 attack per turn MODEL minimum of 1... so high attack units end out with 1 attack each arfter 2+ assault phases, so if 3 squads charged ^_^)


You're misreading this rule. It says "Enemy models that direct their attacks towards the Exarch's squad lose 1 attack, to a minimum of 1." It doesn't say that enemy models lose one attack per DA unit that charges them.

That means that enemy models only lose an attack if they direct their attacks to the squad. Since most of the models won't be directing attacks against multiple squads, they will only lose one attack each. It would be foolish for your opponent to have any of his models split attack, which is what is required to lose more than one attack.

[Lupercal]

I don't play in tournaments, but in the friendly games I play defenders always work well for me.

I run a 20-man squad with Scatter Laser and Warlock with Conceal and Spear. This gives me a little long-range punch, as well as a chance to kill a tank in close range. And the guardians can unleash some withering fire once they get close.

The trick to making the Guardian Defenders work is to have many other, more obvious and survivable threats on the table, and to be very aggressive. Everyone knows the guardians are fragile and have short range with their shuriken catapults. They don't seem very threatening, even with a full squad of 20 on the table. It's fairly easy to distract your opponent with the rest of your army while the guardians move up.

Of course, you want to try not to let them get assaulted by any unit that is anywhere near full strength, which is where the withering fire at close range comes into play. If you can manage to get them into range without casualties, you can average 11 wounds on a squad of marines, killing 3-4 of them. This greatly increases your odds of surviving a charge.

Ultimately, it's all about synergy. I've been playing Eldar for a long time, so my tactics work for me but might sound crazy to others. Learn exactly what each of your units can do and experiment with ways that they can support each other. I particularly like unorthodox armies and tactics, because they force the opponent to rethink their assumptions, and that gives me a psychological advantage.

"It's crazy, but it just might work!"

[fuzzbuket]

@ darklink ahh i see now about combining parry but still- DAs are xurviviable due to a 18' range aka 6' out of bolter-hell/ rapid fire

[Cyberscape7]

I've noticed that a few posts have included synergy. I have considered pairing up my guardians ith a wraithlord. It'll basically allow my guardians to shoot everyone with scatter laser and, if they aren't distracted by the scorps sneaking up on their devestator-esq squad, the wraithlord will make sure nothing gets too close. Plus if I have a warlock, no wraithsight:D
Thoughts?...

[davel]

it's a clasic combo. It also allows the squad to deal with "threats" to the wraith lord. The particular threat in mind is weak hordes which are unbreakable, like guants. they will never beat down your lord but he will be squishing them all battle and not acheive much else. they can get the drop and thin the herd intercept the assult leaving the lord free. It is still avdvisable to have a counter assult unit to rescue guardians as eventually they will lose.

dave l