Experimental Characters

[Erasmus of Baal]

I'm just looking for input on some ideas that I had for characters. Blood Angels have a lot of shooting potential, but no good way to tie that in to the army being a mobile, assault-oriented force. These guys tend to be around the theme of enhancing shooting. (The exception to this is the Terminator Sergeant Josiah, but I'm not sure he's such a good idea anyways.)

Chapter Master John Grimm (HQ, 200 pts)
WS 5, BS 6, S4, T4, A3, I4, W4, Ld10, Sv2+(4++)
--Crusader’s Imperative: gets +1 to all save rolls (1 always fails)
--May fire boltgun and still assault, conferred to squad.
--Independent Character
--Modified boltgun: S6 AP3 36” Rapid Fire; makes close-combat attacks at +1 Str
--Iron Halo

Tactical Sergeant Damien (+50 pts)
WS4, BS5, S4, T4, A2(3), I4, W2, Ld9, Sv3+
--Upgrade character for one Tactical squad, replaces Sergeant
--Wields 2 bolt pistols, may fire both in one round of shooting (extra attack accounted for in profile)
--If squad is assaulted, may fire their shooting weapons instead of fighting in the first round of combat at I10. Casualties count towards combat resolution. This ability may not be used if squad is already in combat.

Captain Matthias the Nightmare (175 pts.)
WS4, BS5, S4, T4, A3, I4, W3, Ld9, Sv3+
--Agile: has 3+ Inv. save, Runs 2D6”
--not Independent Character
--Relentless, Fearless, Move Through Cover
--Double shots for all models within 6” (even for Rapid Fire, even for vehicles, even for self)
--Special boltgun: S5 AP4 30” Rapid Fire

Librarian Delfias the Oracle (HQ, 190 pts)
WS4, BS4, S4, T4, A2, I4, W3, Ld10, Sv3+
--Psyker; may cast 2 powers per turn
--Force weapon, bolt pistol
Powers list:
--Hyperawareness: cast at beginning of any phase; gain +2 to all saves and Feel No Pain tests taken by Delfias during that phase
--Psionic Force: cast during either Movement phase, Delfias targets any unit; unit has 5+ invulnerable save on every model (whether increase or decrease) for the duration of that player turn.
--Mental Accuracy: Cast on any unit at the beginning of any phase; unit gains +1 to all rolls to hit and to wound during that phase
--Preternatural Footing: cast on any unit at the beginning of Delfias’ controller’s player turn; target counts as always rolling 6s for Difficult Terrain and Run tests for the duration of that turn.
wields Force Weapon, plasma pistol

Terminator Sergeant Josiah (+?? points)
WS4, BS4, S4, T4, A2, I4, W2, Ld9, Sv2+5++
--Upgrade character for a unit of standard Terminators; replaces Sergeant.
--Terminator armor, power fist, storm bolter
--All terminators in the unit (including Josiah) gain +1 Attacks
--Josiah attacks in regular Initiative order rather than at I1.


Well, yeah. Any reactions, friends?

[brains]

okay, the termie dude is useless. You cant mix a powerfist with anything other than another powerfist. Their is no reason for the nightmare dude not to be an independent character, he's more or less normal, unlike mephistion or the sanguinator. I like the tact Sergent, but letting the other side hit automatically is a death sentence, Also, if these are blood angels, why do they have a second chapter maste

[Erasmus of Baal]

okay, the termie dude is useless. You cant mix a powerfist with anything other than another powerfist.

You're absolutely right, I didn't make it clear that it's supposed to give them an additional Power Fist Attack. Edit complete after I post this.


Their is no reason for the nightmare dude not to be an independent character, he's more or less normal, unlike mephistion or the sanguinator.

It stems from my inspiration for the guy, I can understand the problem with it. I decided to make him a shooting-based Sanguinor, but you'reright, maybe that should be taken out.


I like the tact Sergent, but letting the other side hit automatically is a death sentence,

Well, really, it's trying to keep the ability from being overpowered. The Tactical Squad now has the ability to ignore some armor saves (read: most Orks' and most Nids') and are all firing twice, before the assaulters get to react. That's pretty big, there. A fair point, though.


Also, if these are blood angels, why do they have a second chapter maste

They were originally designed for a custom Chapter of mine, and I didn't want to use any of the existing characters as my Chapter Master, that's all. My apologies for not making that clear.

[brains]

Well, really, it's trying to keep the ability from being overpowered. The Tactical Squad now has the ability to ignore some armor saves (read: most Orks' and most Nids') and are all firing twice, before the assaulters get to react. That's pretty big, there. A fair point, though.


Two more things. One, something I just remembered, he should just let bolters fire. Pistols firing is covered by the hand to hand rules, and heavy bolters firing is just cheating.

Two, the, "letting the others guys auto hit" is not what makes it balanced. the "I pay an extra fifty points and lose my close combat attacks" is what makes it balanced.

[Erasmus of Baal]

1) Without it being all Bolt weapons, the squad would be better off getting counter-charge, as both special/heavy weapons users and the Sergeant himself would have more attacks. The idea here is that the squad is just standing still and opening fire so that the enemies are too few to do any relevant damage. Although, you do have a good point about the Heavy Bolter; the rule might be better off being all Rapid Fire and Pistol weapons, maybe even Assault weapons, and not any Heavy weapons.

2) No, I'm losing my close combat attacks and paying extra to get to fight with more Attacks than usual, ignore Armor Saves on many close-combat troops, and pretty much always strike first. I'm getting automatically hit to account for me automatically hitting.

[brains]

2) No, I'm losing my close combat attacks and paying extra to get to fight with more Attacks than usual, ignore Armor Saves on many close-combat troops, and pretty much always strike first. I'm getting automatically hit to account for me automatically hitting.

speaking of which, the auto-hit thing is weird. Nothing else in warhammer is automatic, there is always something that can go wrong. You can miss at one inch away, so it shouldn't be easier when your being charged. also, your not actually ignoring that many armor saves. you've got nids, orks, eldar, dark eldar, and guard. But, its not even that good, because any save under 5+ is unreliable. Plus, most things that charge marines have probably got some tricks, like carapace armor, invulnerable saves, or just enough bodies to not care. do away with the auto hits on both sides

[Erasmus of Baal]

speaking of which, the auto-hit thing is weird. Nothing else in warhammer is automatic, there is always something that can go wrong. You can miss at one inch away, so it shouldn't be easier when your being charged. also, your not actually ignoring that many armor saves. you've got nids, orks, eldar, dark eldar, and guard. But, its not even that good, because any save under 5+ is unreliable. Plus, most things that charge marines have probably got some tricks, like carapace armor, invulnerable saves, or just enough bodies to not care. do away with the auto hits on both sides

The idea was to represent firing at point-blank range, and then you can't switch weapons in time to defend yourself effectively, but I can see your point. I'll make the change.

[Tynskel]

Hmmm.

In close combat, it is assumed you are using every weapon at your disposal--- guns, knives, teeth.
The only difference is that all weapons are 'normalized' to either ignoring armor, or not ignoring armor.

There are things in 40k that auto hit--- and in fact, the codex for the basis of the characters has a character (seth) that auto-hits!


Here's the best thing to do with Special Rules: KISS!
Keep It Simple, Stupid!

So, instead of all the weird rules, just switch it to: During the first round of Close Combat, the Defenders Strike at I10. Simple.

[Erasmus of Baal]

Here's the best thing to do with Special Rules: KISS!
Keep It Simple, Stupid!

So, instead of all the weird rules, just switch it to: During the first round of Close Combat, the Defenders Strike at I10. Simple.

The shooting mechanic is pretty simple, really, and it actually gives a Tactical Squad more "attacks" than if they're just melee fighting. I am keeping it simple (at least, now that the whole bit about auto-hitting has been removed and I'm about to simplify which weapons can be fired).

[Tynskel]

he's a tactical sgt. So the squad won't be overloaded on hv weapons: I would allow all weapons to fire. That's easy:

If super sgt's squad is assaulted, the squad fires their weapons instead of fighting in the first round of combat at I10. Casualties count towards combat resolution.

It shouldn't matter that whether there are hv weapons, pistols, assault, or rapid fire--- these are Space Marines, and Sgt So n' So has trained them to fight this way!

[Erasmus of Baal]

Right, well, I put it that way to concede to brains that firing Heavy Weapons might be a little too powerful, but I like how you phrase it--unless you don't like me doing it, I'll just copy-paste that.