Chaos Daemon/Marine Army for Vs Tyranids

[Unzuul the Lascivious]

After a long postponement and a little tester game vs Nids, the big 4170 point game Vs Tyranids is upon me in less than two weeks. Here is my final list:-

The Unclean Pact of Typhus and Ku’Gath

Typhus – 225 points
Plagueguard Terminators –
2xTwin Bolter and Power Weapon
1xCombi Melta and Powerfist, Icon of Nurgle
2xHeavy Flamer and Powerfist – 215 points

Plague Marine Squad One – 4 Bolter, 1 Plasma Gun, Icon – 135 points

Plague Marine Squad Two - 4 Bolter, 1 Plasma Gun, Icon – 135 points

Plague Marine Squad Three - Plague Champion with Bolter+ Power Fist, 3 Bolter, 1 Plasma Gun, Icon – 170 points

Plague Marine Squad Four - Plague Champion with Plasma Pistol and Power Weapon, 2 Melta Guns, 2 Bolters, Icon – 170 points

2 Chaos Rhino – 70 pts

Vindicator with Daemonic Possession – 145 points

Ku’Gath the Plaguefather – 300 points

Fateweaver, Oracle of Tzeentch – 333 points

Skulltaker and 20 Bloodletters - 300 points

Epidemius and 12 Plaguebearers - 290 points

12 Plaguebearers + Icon – 205 points

6 Flamers with Bolt of Tzeentch – 240 points

6 Flamers with Bolt of Tzeentch – 240 points

Soul Grinder – Phlegm – 160 points

Soul Grinder – Phlegm – 160 points

10 Pink Horrors with the Changeling = 175 points

10 Pink Horrors= 170 points

10 Seekers of Slaanesh= 170 points

7 bases of Nurglings = 91 points

4168 points

NB. HQ choices have been approved for this game, I know daemons are over limit, they're borrowing from Marines FOC


I recently played a 2000 point game against Nids and the combo of Kugath and Epidemius with that number of Plaguebearers was rock hard. I'm thinking they'll be even tougher with Fateweaver doing his thing, flanked by Pink Horrors. I've been told that my opponent will be taking several Tervigons, which I'm hoping to pummel to bits with heavy fire from the Vindicator and the Soulgrinders. The Rhino are really to block LOS and to try and funnel his hordes into a killing zone of Marines and Horrors. The central bank of Plaguebearers and Horrors, bolstered by Fateweaver will ensure he commits huge amounts of models to destroying them (which I estimate to take at least three turns) giving me a chance to utilise my other troops either for taking objectives or wiping out key units.

So any critiques or tactics via the full panoply of Tyranid organisms is again most welcome. I worry mainly about the Tervigons to be fair, they spawned an average of 12 Gants per turn EACH...

[Connjurus]

I really can't complain with this list at all. The sheer amount of firepower you'll be putting out in a killzone will be impressive, to say the least.

Wait, found a complaint - NEEDS MOAR TZEENTCH. xD

But that's just because he's my favorite. I eagerly await hearing about how your Plaguemarines become unstoppable killing machines with power weapons that wound on a 2+ and 3+ FNPs. That will just devastate anything that comes their way, up to and including Hive Tyrants.

[Unzuul the Lascivious]

You have no idea how pleased I am to hear this! It took my last opponent this many miniatures to destroy my 24 Plaguebearers plus Epidemius last game: -1 hive tyrant(didn't make close combat but suported with shooting and reduced them to WS1 and allowed prefered enemy to about half the termagants and the hormagaunts)
30 hormagaunts with poison(close combat only)
40 termagants (shooting and close combat)
Tervigon(Again didn't make close combat but shot and gave poison attacks to the gaunts.
4 Tyranid warriors (shooting only).
2 zoanthropes(shooting only)
And after all this one of em still survived only dying with the over-run of wounds due to being fearless.

[Connjurus]

The good thing about Plaguemarines over plaguebearers is that they have bolters and 3+ armor saves - so park them behind a line of plaguebearers and have it. Because that ignore armor save thing? ALL attacks - including those bolters - will ignore saves. Those terminator heavy flamers? Yeah, that'll be awesome. So will all those bolt shots you're getting.

[Unzuul the Lascivious]

He's not gonna know what hit him! Hopefully he'll take enough swarm creatures to boost the Tally real quick! This game is totally going to kick wang!

[Connjurus]

It really will - Tyranid are one of the armies I always feel really excited about playing. xP I just hardly ever get to play them. :(

[Xas]

It all depends on your oponent and his list.

I assume you are playing a doubled FOC (4Hq 6 elites, 12troop, 6 FA, 6HS) with normal rules, not apoc, right?


Against even a semi-decent list I wouldnt count on the rhinos doing anything but dying to hiveguard shooting turn 1.

If you want to use epidemus' tally then you need more nurgle. ATM all I see is a handfull of termis, 20 plaquemarins, 12 plaquebearers and 7 nurglings and kugath who doesnt get much out of the tally other than a bit better FNP.

If you dont want epidemus to die very, very fast you have to park him somewhere in the back in a big unit (to keep lictors away). you are prolly useing the plaguebearers for that so all nurgle that is left are the termis (only get armor ignoring bolters), marines (FNP 3+, ap 2 bolters and power weapons im melee so quite nice) and nurglings (armor ignoring is nice but with s3 they arent going to find many things they can wound reliably AND have a good enough save to matter).

as the PM really benefit from this the most I'd suggest you simply go full fluff, get rid of all non-nurlge deamons (the soulgrinders can stay if you like them) and ivnest the reast into nurgle deamons and plaguemarines.

even then I wouldnt think this is at all easy for you if your oponent knows his craft. nurgle tally is nice but even if armor ignoring bolters and flamers sound cool it is not THAT hughe of a deal against nids because your ap5 is enough on the stuff you are going to wound in big quantities already. what gets really dangerous are plaguebearers because they get poison 2+ on the way with armor ignoring in melee so they can cut trough all the monsters in no time if they get to strike.


what you should watch out for:

shooting - nid shooting is as brutal as can be especially against a mostly infantry army like yours. especially the nun-nurgle stuff is very squishy to tyranid shooting.

exotic deploying melee - flanking and deepstriking as well as lictor deployment can ruin your day. hormagaunts that flank thanks to a hivetyrant and reliably charge a total of 16-18"(6"move + 3d6 highest fleet + 6" charge) from the edge and then go on with 3 s4 poison 4+ rerolling 1s to hit attacks per modell thanks to both upgrades will brutalize anything they contact that is not a walker. 20 of them are only 200 points.
if you just deploy epidemus alone somewhere save a squad of lictors (3 for less than 200points, 15 s6 rending attacks with 9 wounds) will deploy without scatter and hack him down in no time.
drop-pod a like spores can deepstrike up to 20 stealers, 9 warriors or 20 gaunts into your army without any danger of a misshap. in cover stealers are allmost impossible to shift if there is enough of them and not even the bloodletters stand a chance (as you cannot hurt him without melee and he will go before you if you charge or he charges you on the open so if you are in cover he will just charge something shooty). the stealers can also flank and bypass the turn of waiting after dropping.
hivetyrants can give +1 to reserve rolls.

melee - tyranid melee doesnt "work" like your common marine melee. firstly the khorne part is useless. tyranids that are afraid of power weapons are very scarse and there is no chance you gona catch them without getting intercepted by a squad that doesnt care or shot down unless your oponent is braindead. skulltaker is just icing on the cake as he means every worthy target for the bloodletters will stay away from the squad for shure.
additionally nids have easy acess to poison and therefore can easily deal with your monsters and basically ignore nurgle's toughness bonus. for a nid player fateweaver really is a very expensive joke (more so if he has deathleaper as the special lictor will lower your LDS by d3 so in best case you test on lds8 for every wound you take and in worst case on LDS6!).
last but not leas nids have (if you invest time into conversions) good acess to power weapons as well with the boneswords on warriors and natural monstrous creature attacks. they ignore your precious armor and FNP saves.

[Unzuul the Lascivious]

Thanks for your post and for some potential pitfalls. However, I have playtested the Nurgle element - it took 4 Turns for 24 Plaguebearers to be laid low against 20 Gaunts, 36 Gants, a Tervigon and 4 Hive Guard - bolstered by the Tally and Fateweaver, they'll be seriously, ridiculously difficult to down. I know exactly what you mean re the Bloodletters - they are only there for monstrous creature killing - he won't be getting any stealers near them. As for the Stealers, Lictors etc, that's what the Horrors and Flamers are for. I'm expecting stuff to die! The Seekers of Slaanesh will really only be a hold up/objective winning unit.
Besides, I don't have access to any more Nurgle miniatures! The rhino really are sacrificial vehicles anyway so I don't mind about them. But you have definitely given me food for thought here - especially with regards protecting Epidemius. But perhaps I should up the number of Plaguebearers with him. They won't be sat at the back, I'm hoping to use the Nurgle as a shield for other units and light up the flanks with firepower, creating a killing zone in the centre of the board